I don't understand Fran

[PCHawk]

. I never really expected to get this close to the NCAA tourney this year with the youth of this team. I felt he did a good job getting these young players to adjust and compete at the level they did. I really didn't expect much from this year other than hope they all made improvements and show promise for he future. Mission accomplished as far as I am concerned.

I am glad to see that most expect this program to move on and improve. That's what I want also. However am I satisfied on what we have accomplished in eight year? To be honest.......no.

I would like Fran to win at least two games in the BTT and the NCAA tournament at least once every three years. One or two of you have mentioned a sweet 16 and that would help like crazy. Finishing tied with four or five teams for fourth place in the B1G may cut it for you but not me.

Do you go around boasting of it at work or with other sports fans? If so may i suggest meds? The object of big time sports is to be the best at least once in a while. How many walked around and were chanting "were seventy, were seventy, were seventy" when were invited to the the NIT? If you did you have no business EVER making fun of anything ISU fans say or do. In fact if the Iowa achievements in basketball have satisfied you and your happy with losing in the first game in the BTT or being a first seed in the NIT, or losing in the first round of the NCAA and those are the only things you want or expect then maybe you ought to change colors and move to Ames where you will fit in with you cousins.

Just getting to the NCAA is all you ever expect or want? What your saying then is that sixth place in the Big Ten is all you want every year. I want to win the B1G regular season championship. I want to win the Big Ten Tournament and just once In every thirty years win a national championship. A final four once every fifteen years. I don't think that is asking too much.

If you want to play that history crap of this is all Iowa has ever done and we can't expect anything more then ISU is for you. Again, this mindset was what Hayden Fry said was the biggest challenge at Iowa. If the fans expect it and except it then why should the AD ever have to worry about his job or ever being in a hot seat?

We were getting are asses handed to us until Hayden came in and showed WE CAN. If it can happen in football it can in basketball. I am hopeful after watching these freshmen play so well. I still think Joc means more to this team than some are giving him credit for. I would not be surprised if we struggle again next season also, but the year after that is when I expect Iowa to make hay big time. I am not one of those who are calling for Frans head. I am in a wait and see mode right now. Two to three more years to prove he can win a B1G title or tournament or at least come very close. A sweet sixteen also would also be nice in the next three years. I would feel much better if he just does one of theses things but both would be great. Then I will be satisfied that he should stay on as coach. If not then changes need to be made.

Everyone wants more than tied for 3rd place finishes. It's just that most people don't call for a coaches head because he only got a 3rd place finish.

To me tho, it's not about being satisfied with past results. It's about being satisfied with the direction of the program. If Bohannon and Pemsl didn't look so much better than they were supposed to, if Cook looked like a bust, if Garza and Nunge didn't look like serious studs, or if Weiscamp and Frans kids didn't look really good, I would be concerned about the direction of the program. As it is I feel like it's an almost certainty that we will be really good for the foreseeable future. That's what I care about. I don't care and much about past results that can be skewed by bad bounces, teams going cold, bad draws in tournaments, or kids getting cancer. I'm concerned with what I see. Not just looking at a w-l record.

 

[BigD]

You wonder why his teams couldn't score 51? Really? Did you actually watch any of those games? How many times did we pass the ball around until 5 seconds left on the shot clock and then heave a highly contested 3? How many times did we walk the ball up the court? Here's a better question: how come you can count the number of fast break points Iowa scored per game on one hand?

Face it. Lick ball was to hold until the last possible moment and then shoot. This leads to less possessions during the game and lower scores as a rule. I have no doubt that if there wasn't a shot clock at the time, a lot of Lick-coached games would end with the score 4-2 with Iowa shooting 50% from the field and losing.

Lol, I agree. Interesting and true point you make about Lick having his players pass the ball around until five seconds left on the clock. This was my complaint with Fran having a player stand out at the top of the key and let the clock fun down until eight seconds are left on the clock. Same result. I wish Fran would stop doing that.

 

[BigD]

Everyone wants more than tied for 3rd place finishes. It's just that most people don't call for a coaches head because he only got a 3rd place finish.

To me tho, it's not about being satisfied with past results. It's about being satisfied with the direction of the program. If Bohannon and Pemsl didn't look so much better than they were supposed to, if Cook looked like a bust, if Garza and Nunge didn't look like serious studs, or if Weiscamp and Frans kids didn't look really good, I would be concerned about the direction of the program. As it is I feel like it's an almost certainty that we will be really good for the foreseeable future. That's what I care about. I don't care and much about past results that can be skewed by bad bounces, teams going cold, bad draws in tournaments, or kids getting cancer. I'm concerned with what I see. Not just looking at a w-l record.

Ok PC just at what point would you say Fran needs to go. What would it take?

"I don't care and much about past results that can be skewed by bad bounces, teams going cold, bad draws in tournaments, or kids getting cancer. I'm concerned with what I see. Not just looking at a w-l record." Wow!!!!!! Sounds like you have built in excuses for the next several years. That sounds about as "participation trophy" as you can possibly get.

 

[InGoodCo]

Everyone wants more than tied for 3rd place finishes. It's just that most people don't call for a coaches head because he only got a 3rd place finish.

To me tho, it's not about being satisfied with past results. It's about being satisfied with the direction of the program. If Bohannon and Pemsl didn't look so much better than they were supposed to, if Cook looked like a bust, if Garza and Nunge didn't look like serious studs, or if Weiscamp and Frans kids didn't look really good, I would be concerned about the direction of the program. As it is I feel like it's an almost certainty that we will be really good for the foreseeable future. That's what I care about. I don't care and much about past results that can be skewed by bad bounces, teams going cold, bad draws in tournaments, or kids getting cancer. I'm concerned with what I see. Not just looking at a w-l record.

No way I could have said it better. I want better place finishes to - i expect them, but I also recognize that Fran has done a tremendous job with what he had and he'd brought Iowa back to consistently good and competitive basketball. I think - if he was able to get Iowa to where he has off his first recruiting cycle which was largely compiled on the heels of the worst era in school history, imagine what he can do once he gets the program on better footing? As you stated earlier - an NIT bid is probably Fran's floor from here on out barring injury and Iowa looks to be good in basketball for the foreseeable future.

 

[InGoodCo]

Ok PC just at what point would you say Fran needs to go. What would it take?

"I don't care and much about past results that can be skewed by bad bounces, teams going cold, bad draws in tournaments, or kids getting cancer. I'm concerned with what I see. Not just looking at a w-l record." Wow!!!!!! Sounds like you have built in excuses for the next several years. That sounds about as "participation trophy" as you can possibly get.

I think you have reading incomprehension.

 

[BigD]

Anyone who goes around bragging about how good the team they cheer for does needs meds period. Why would you brag about something you played no part in?

I don't know why do they high five each other after a great play they had nothing to do with? Why do they buy shirts, sweaters, stickers, rugs, coats, with their favorite team logo on it when they have nothing to do with it. People cheer for their team to win not lose. People want to identify with a winner especially competitive people. Some people are different I guess.
.

 

[BigD]

I think you have reading incomprehension.

You say you are expecting better things to come and I feel the same way but it's a simple question. At what point do you pull the plug? What would it take?

 

[InGoodCo]

You say you are expecting better things to come and I feel the same way but it's a simple question. At what point do you pull the plug? What would it take?

Missing the NCAA 3 seasons in a row at any point. 1 season rebuilds are always going to be a thing at Iowa - they have been for every coach, if they can gain mo and make the NIT during that all the better. Miss it 2 years and the seat is so hot he's coaching for his job the next year- and I'll be loudly calling for it - miss it 3 and he's out. It's not something i think any of us will need to worry about. I would add that he needs to make at least a sweet 16 over next 3 seasons for me to feel really good about the direction of the program.

 

[PCHawk]

Ok PC just at what point would you say Fran needs to go. What would it take?

"I don't care and much about past results that can be skewed by bad bounces, teams going cold, bad draws in tournaments, or kids getting cancer. I'm concerned with what I see. Not just looking at a w-l record." Wow!!!!!! Sounds like you have built in excuses for the next several years. That sounds about as "participation trophy" as you can possibly get.

He is winning big 10 games at a rate rarely, if ever, seen at Iowa. You don't fire coaches who are doing things that no Iowa coach has ever done before. Especially when the recruits he's bringing in are better than the ones he broke records with. Thinking Fran is doing a bad job is as dumb as saying it makes you competitive to freak out more than other fans when a team you don't even play on doesn't meet expectations.

 

[PCHawk]

Missing the NCAA 3 seasons in a row at any point. 1 season rebuilds are always going to be a thing at Iowa - they have been for every coach, if they can gain mo and make the NIT during that all the better. Miss it 2 years and the seat is so hot he's coaching for his job the next year- and I'll be loudly calling for it - miss it 3 and he's out. It's not something i think any of us will need to worry about. I would add that he needs to make at least a sweet 16 over next 3 seasons for me to feel really good about the direction of the program.

I agree about 3 year and you're gone baring injuries. If you miss the tournament 3 years in a row, something is up. Demanding championships or you're fired is stupid when you coach in a league with as many good teams and coaches as the Big 10 has. Especially before Ryan left.

Speaking of which, hasn't Fran won more Big 10 games over the last 3 years than any other program but MSU and Wisconsin? I'm so uncompetitive to think that's not as fireable offense.

 

[tksirius]

Missing the NCAA 3 seasons in a row at any point. 1 season rebuilds are always going to be a thing at Iowa - they have been for every coach, if they can gain mo and make the NIT during that all the better. Miss it 2 years and the seat is so hot he's coaching for his job the next year- and I'll be loudly calling for it - miss it 3 and he's out. It's not something i think any of us will need to worry about. I would add that he needs to make at least a sweet 16 over next 3 seasons for me to feel really good about the direction of the program.

I'm glad we now agree on this.

At this point, Fran is calling the shots about his future at Iowa. I honestly think it would take missing the NCAA 3 seasons straight before the seat was even remotely warm and the "how long do we accept" this mentality would be called for.

Lol if we miss the next 2 tourneys, Fran's seat will most definitely be hot. 3 in a row and he's gone for sure.

https://hawkeyenation.com/forum/threads/how-much-longer-does-fran-get.77596/

 

[BigD]

I agree about 3 year and you're gone baring injuries. If you miss the tournament 3 years in a row, something is up. Demanding championships or you're fired is stupid when you coach in a league with as many good teams and coaches as the Big 10 has. Especially before Ryan left.

Speaking of which, hasn't Fran won more Big 10 games over the last 3 years than any other program but MSU and Wisconsin? I'm so uncompetitive to think that's not as fireable offense.

Well at least your honest about not expecting a championship. I don't expect it either it's just a wish list. Would love for it to happen. I believe we're good enough to make it happen as everything is in place for it to happen. Facilities and fan base as good as they come. I just can't help wanting to be the best in the B1G once in awhile. Expecting it every year is unrealistic.

 

[PCHawk]

I'm glad we now agree on this.





https://hawkeyenation.com/forum/threads/how-much-longer-does-fran-get.77596/

The old post you quoted was him saying what he thinks would get his seat warm. The new post was him saying when he would want him fired. Those are two separate things.

 

[tksirius]

The old post you quoted was him saying what he thinks would get his seat warm. The new post was him saying when he would want him fired. Those are two separate things.

Lol #ZeroIntegrity

 

[BigD]

Missing the NCAA 3 seasons in a row at any point. 1 season rebuilds are always going to be a thing at Iowa - they have been for every coach, if they can gain mo and make the NIT during that all the better. Miss it 2 years and the seat is so hot he's coaching for his job the next year- and I'll be loudly calling for it - miss it 3 and he's out. It's not something i think any of us will need to worry about. I would add that he needs to make at least a sweet 16 over next 3 seasons for me to feel really good about the direction of the program.

That's seems fairly reasonable. I would put some stipulations on it though. For example, just making the Big Dance just because you finished in sixth place three years in a row but lost in the first round of the Big dance and also in the first round in the BTT three years in a row would be grounds for termination IMHO.

 

[BigD]

Interesting that Alford had pressure put on him publicly after finishing in second place in the conference and having two BTT championships under his belt in eight years. An early exit in the Big dance had some thing to do with that with a team loaded with talent. Will Barta hold the same expectations from Fran?

 

[PCHawk]

Interesting that Alford had pressure put on him publicly after finishing in second place in the conference and having two BTT championships under his belt in eight years. An early exit in the Big dance had some thing to do with that with a team loaded with talent. Will Barta hold the same expectations from Fran?

I think Alford was more about off the court stuff.

 

[PCHawk]

Am I the only one who doesn't care about the Big 10 tournament at all as far as judging a coach goes. I hate when we lose early because basketball every day is awesome. I just don't care as far as expectations for a coach. My main concern is regular season. My second concern is NCAA tournament. But even that isn't as much of a concern because one and done settings are too random to base what to do with a coach on. Unless they flame out constantly as a way higher seed.

 

[PCHawk]

That's seems fairly reasonable. I would put some stipulations on it though. For example, just making the Big Dance just because you finished in sixth place three years in a row but lost in the first round of the Big dance and also in the first round in the BTT three years in a row would be grounds for termination IMHO.

I agree that's not enough once the program is on sold ground. When we got rid of Davis, Iowa had a lot better reputation as a program than it does now so finding a better coach is a lot more feasible. We are still putting the Lick years behind us and the further away they get, the better off we are. Bringing in a coach that has a reasonable chance to do better than Fran wouldn't be as easy now as it would be after a few more shitty ass 3rd place finishes. Basically what I'm saying is, the more time that passes where we're a good program, the better chance we have of bringing in a coach that will make us a great program.

 

[BigD]

I agree that's not enough once the program is on sold ground. When we got rid of Davis, Iowa had a lot better reputation as a program than it does now so finding a better coach is a lot more feasible. We are still putting the Lick years behind us and the further away they get, the better off we are. Bringing in a coach that has a reasonable chance to do better than Fran wouldn't be as easy now as it would be after a few more shitty ass 3rd place finishes. Basically what I'm saying is, the more time that passes where we're a good program, the better chance we have of bringing in a coach that will make us a great program.

I agree. I think your being sarcastic on shitty third place finishes remark. If you finish in third place in the B1G that is respectable. I got frustrated with Alford averaging in seventh or eight place. Off the top of my head I don't know what Fran's average place is. If I were to guess I would say fifth or sixth place. We must also remember that on an annual basis we have more basement dwellers in basketball with the recent expansion of teams going all the way back to when Penn State joined. PSU, Nebraska, Rutgers, are not basketball schools to say the least. Could toss Northwestern in there also but they have been pretty bad long before the expansion so that is why I didn't mention them.