Winning culture

bamahawkeye

bamahawkeye

Well-Known Member
This is THE major problem with both the basketball and football programs.

Iowa basketball has been very frustrating (understatement) over the last decade, but tonight was beyond what I can remember. This game and the Creighton game were painful to watch.This team shows no heart, no fight, no leadership and no energy when things aren't going well. This program just simply hasn't produced a winning environment. We could talk about why that is all day long, but for sanity purposes, let's stick with where this program is right now.

For starters, your 3 best players have to play like that. If Gatens, Cartwright and Basabe don't start playing better (Gatens has played well except for tonight), this team may not win 10 games. I believe part of the expectations that Mac had this thing going in the right direction is because of these 3 guys. And if they aren't producing, well...the evidence is in the first 7 games. Secondly, if May, Brommer and McCabe are playing major minutes, I'm sorry but the ceiling is pretty limited. All 3 guys can give you 10-12 of minutes of good basketball, but that should be as much as they're asked to give you and their roles are just too big right now. Third, Mac can't play his style with the players he has. Period. You just can't push, press, push, press, push, press if you have a roster full of guys who can't excel in that style. White is a guy that should really flourish in Mac's style. I see why he recruited him. Get him in transition and he can finish. You can tell he really likes Ogelsby and has given him a lot of freedom. It should be fun to see him knocking down 3's on the wing in transition. But quite frankly, this team just isn't built to run efficiently in an up-tempo style right now. Heck, this team is struggling in a half-court style right now. And finally, and back to the title of this thread, the attitude and leadership of this club isn't going to get it done. I believe Mac will be able to change this culture. I really do. But the Creighton loss and tonight's loss show how difficult his job is right now. I've never seen a club fold like this team did against those two teams. I think next year's class will give Mac and this program a much needed lift. But a big part of that lift is going to be Basabe playing like he is capable of playing. To be continued......

Heading into this year, I believe most Iowa fans and I believe Mac himself thought this club would be taking a step forward. After tonight, I'm not sure this club hasn't gone backwards. I think that will change once Cartwright and Basabe start playing better, but until then......
 
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Time to go with this lineup:

Cartwright
Oglesby
Gatens
White
McCabe

May and Mel need to sit. It's going to be (another) long year.
 
I'm more depressed about Bball...with football I know what to expect and what I will get...they will be in almost ALL games whether the opponent is VERY bad or VERY good....basketball...I was expecting progress and excitement....and instead....we are not even competitive. I'm beginning to wonder if OSU will let us score more than 20.....
 
HaydenHawk56 said:
Good post. Right on the mark.
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Really Hayden? Winning Culture and he includes football. Hayden and Kirk have coached a combined 33 seasons. Iowa has finished under .500 only 8 Times in those 33 years and went to 23 bowls. That's isn't a winning culture?
 
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Iowa football has only had one losing season in the last 11....they should not be lumped in with a bb program that is clearly on its way to its 5th straight losing season. Fans used to mock when SA would mention that Iowa bb had 8 straight winning seasons ....not that funny now,tho. We used to think a winning season was nothing in bb, but now it is proving very elusive.
It will allow some fans to appreciate it more when Fran does get us back winning again,I suppose. No mocking of a winning season at Iowa for awhile,I suspect.
 
Reading around I have noticed some people are being pretty critical of Fran.

I would just like to say that Fran has the program going in the right direction. We just don't have the talent/consistency that we need to be successful this season. Obviously if Basabe can pick things up (and I believe he will)... we will look like an entirely different team out there. Just need to get him in a rhythm and the entire team will play better as a result.

Also, our defense is atrocious right now. It is absolutely pathetic and I KNOW Fran is trying to coach them defense and how to play better D than what they are showing.

People need to remember that Fran can't make shots/layups for these guys. Fran can't play good defense for these guys. They have to do that. That is the big difference in why I am so confident in the basketball program under Fran, because he is giving these guys the coaching and recruiting the players we need to be successful and is teaching them an offense and a play style that has is very good and can lead to a lot of success once he gets the right players in there.

And for anyone that says "but KF can't execute for his players either" ...You are right. He can't, but he can give them a better chance of being successful by adapting our style of play, making better in-game decision, managing the clock better, playcalling, etc. And I belive KF is a great coach and he just needs to be willing to change and adapt and make sure he brings in good talent and find a way to keep them here.

Back on topic: Fran is going to improve this program, if not get them to the point where we are playing in the big dance. It will take some time. Be patient.

Side note: this team is better than how they are playing, they just need to put the pieces together and get in a rhythm. Playing good team defense will make this team 200x better.
 
HawkPrdatr40 said:
You lost credibility with me right from the start. Saying Iowa football has an issue with it's winning culture. That is so wrong!!
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Let me start by saying this was supposed to be a basketball thread, but I feel like the football and basketball teams are in the same zip code right now, and that is why I lumped them in. I see the same things the last 2 years in football that I'm seeing on the basketball court. A winning culture isn't going 8-5, or 7-5 in my opinion. A winning culture doesn't include losing to teams you should beat every year (a la ISU, Minny). I look at the PSU and Nebby losses the same way I do the Creighton and Clemson losses. My point is....KF and Hayden should get credit for the good things they brought to the University of Iowa. No doubt. But the last few years that Hayden was driving the truck, and the last 2 years under KF's reign shouldn't be glazed over. The culture right now in football looks nothing like '02 to '04, or '08 and '09.
 
JHHawk said:
Iowa football has only had one losing season in the last 11....they should not be lumped in with a bb program that is clearly on its way to its 5th straight losing season. Fans used to mock when SA would mention that Iowa bb had 8 straight winning seasons ....not that funny now,tho.

I guess this is where I differ than some on this board. And I don't think you are wrong for defining "winning culture" this way. But I don't quite frankly see Alford creating a winning culture at Iowa. If he did, he'd still be here. Winning seasons don't define winning culture for me. In basketball, the NCAA tournament should be your benchmark, not going 19-15. In football, there is no reason Iowa shouldn't win 9 games a year. KF has proven he can create a culture that produces quality at a high level. But 7-6, 6-6, 8-5, 7-5 doesn't scream winning culture. Again, I'm not saying you are wrong, I'm saying this is where we differ.
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bamahawkeye said:
Let me start by saying this was supposed to be a basketball thread, but I feel like the football and basketball teams are in the same zip code right now, and that is why I lumped them in.
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I am glad that you wrote this first, so I knew not to bother to read any of the rest of it.

Get a freaking clue, and then try posting again.
 
Like many people have said. We lack players, pure and simple. It doesn't take 4 years to have a good team in basketball. We need better recruiters. This year's class is ranked fairly high because of numbers. Only Woodbury had an impressive offer list.
 
GhostofBTT said:
I am glad that you wrote this first, so I knew not to bother to read any of the rest of it.

Get a freaking clue, and then try posting again.
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Get a clue about what? I'd love to hear your take. I'm all for discussion, just not random posts that call people out. If you have a viewpoint, by all means share it.
 
bamahawkeye said:
JHHawk said:
Iowa football has only had one losing season in the last 11....they should not be lumped in with a bb program that is clearly on its way to its 5th straight losing season. Fans used to mock when SA would mention that Iowa bb had 8 straight winning seasons ....not that funny now,tho.

I guess this is where I differ than some on this board. And I don't think you are wrong for defining "winning culture" this way. But I don't quite frankly see Alford creating a winning culture at Iowa. If he did, he'd still be here. Winning seasons don't define winning culture for me. In basketball, the NCAA tournament should be your benchmark, not going 19-15. In football, there is no reason Iowa shouldn't win 9 games a year. KF has proven he can create a culture that produces quality at a high level. But 7-6, 6-6, 8-5, 7-5 doesn't scream winning culture. Again, I'm not saying you are wrong, I'm saying this is where we differ.
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By your definition,there is only one ''winning culture'' in the Big Ten in football...you know,OSU,the one that is headed to probation next year.
And maybe 4-5 in the whole nation. That means that at least 116 programs,ie...98% do not have a ''winning culture''. I want a good coach but do not expect Jesus Christ with a whistle,which is what it would take for a coach to have Iowa football among the top 4% in the country in a state that produces 2 -3 Div 1 recruits /year compared to literally hundreds in Bama and La. KF would only need a miracle everyday.

As for bb, again, making the NCAA tourny every year is a nice goal,but things have changed since Tom Davis left...Wis used to suck,and now they don't,for instance. SA made the tourny 3 of 8 years,which is a bit below par,but in case you haven't noticed Iowa has not win a Big Ten title since 1979,which means Iowa is no longer a bb powerhouse,or even close.
If Fran can make the NCAA 50% of his years at iowa, he will be a superior hire.
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Maybe we need someone to come and talk to the team before the games. I'm sure we could get Charlie Sheen. #WINNING
 
Winning culture - winning at a consistently high level; finding ways to win games against teams that aren't as good as you; finding ways to win games when things aren't going your way; building an attitude and a foundation that is passed on from class to class, leader to underclassmen, an attitude that breeds winning year after year.

Every team will go through a year, or a period of seasons where expectations aren't met, or they have down years. But this proves my point. When this happens, the culture of winning starts to disappear and it has to be rediscovered. Florida is an example of this right now; the Lakers in the 90's. The winning culture was lost, but that doesn't mean it can't be found or created (or recreated). And maybe that's where I went wrong with this thread. This culture doesn't exist right now in either the football or basketball lockeroom. But it can change.

Now, if we want to talk about the obstacles KF has, and that for the cards he is dealt, and then we say "this" is how a winning culture should be defined at Iowa....that is another discussion in my opinion. My definition of a winning culture is above. That is how I see it, no matter what kind of program you are or what your name is. That is how I would define it in college or pro sports.

If what happened in '10 and this year is deemed a "winning culture" at Iowa, so be it. I don't define it that way. If Mac going to the NCAA tourney 3 out of every 8 years like Alford is deemed a "winning culture" at Iowa, so be it. I don't define it that way. I don't believe KF or Mac would define either of those scenarios as a winning culture either.

Winning is an attitude. You know how to win and you find ways to win. My whole point is that neither the football team or basketball team has that attitude or know how right now. Hence, a winning environment is not there.

Again, we can argue all day long about how do you define a winning culture at Iowa. But ''my" definition of a "winning culture" is not what I see at Iowa.
 
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