Why short three step drops against ISU

[scottsdalehawk]

But longer, 5 and 7 step drops against the blitzing team?

I am officially questioning the game play calling strategy....

ISU didn't blitz at all and stanzi was releasing the ball like it was fresh out of the oven....

Against AZ with the all out blitzing strategy we continually hung onto the ball looking way downfield.....

please tell me this won't happen anymore

 

[okeefe4prez]

Don't question O'Keefe. We were playing from behind and he was on the sideline, not you.

 

[PlanoHawk]

ah- just like the radio shows... question kenny and get the drop button

 

[MidnightBlueSix]

I think it has to do with us trying to come back from behind. We were shooting more downfield for big gains and the routes were deeper, thus requiring a longer drop to give the play time to develop. Also, ISU was getting gashed by the run game, so that opened up the pass game a lot more on the short routes. The LBs were focused on stopping the run.

 

[okeefe4prez]

I think it has to do with us trying to come back from behind. We were shooting more downfield for big gains and the routes were deeper, thus requiring a longer drop to give the play time to develop. Also, ISU was getting gashed by the run game, so that opened up the pass game a lot more on the short routes. The LBs were focused on stopping the run.

This is the credited response. Playing from behind is completely different than controlling the ball for the whole first quarter and nursing a lead of at least 2 TDs for 3/4ths of the game. Plus, AZ's DBs are way better than ISU's.

 

[homerHAWKeye777]

But longer, 5 and 7 step drops against the blitzing team?

I am officially questioning the game play calling strategy....

ISU didn't blitz at all and stanzi was releasing the ball like it was fresh out of the oven....

Against AZ with the all out blitzing strategy we continually hung onto the ball looking way downfield.....

please tell me this won't happen anymore

I presume that it was also part of the prep for the rest of the season ... including the Arizona game. Unfortunately, we had gotten caught behind against UA and we were more forced to try to get yardage in bigger chunks ... hence relying a bit more upon bigger drops.

Also, in the past, ISU has blitzed the crap out of us before. Thus, it was still good prep for us in case they would have done so.

 

[hawkeye12345]

I questioned it too but at this point in the game KOK has his supporters and no matter what kind of game plan he comes up with (right or wrong) they will make some excuse for him and call you out as being a hater.

I don't care if we were playing from behind or not. The game was never out of reach (see the results) and we shouldn't be playing like it is in the 1st 3 quarters. We are not a deep threat passing team, haven't been since the Chuck Long days, so why try being something that you're not. JH didn't get hurt until late in the game so his injury shouldn't be an excuse either.

One of these days our defense isn't going to be able to bail KOK's butt out on a regular basis and hopefully he hits the road. KOK is a fraud as an O coordinator.

 

[DuffMan]

I questioned it too but at this point in the game KOK has his supporters and no matter what kind of game plan he comes up with (right or wrong) they will make some excuse for him and call you out as being a hater.

I don't care if we were playing from behind or not. The game was never out of reach (see the results) and we shouldn't be playing like it is in the 1st 3 quarters. We are not a deep threat passing team, haven't been since the Chuck Long days, so why try being something that you're not. JH didn't get hurt until late in the game so his injury shouldn't be an excuse either.

One of these days our defense isn't going to be able to bail KOK's butt out on a regular basis and hopefully he hits the road. KOK is a fraud as an O coordinator.

This is very bad for a number of reasons.

We were down 14 points before we got off the bus and 20+ at half, and the deep passing game is a big part of why we came back. We were moving the ball at will in the 1st half and without mistakes we should have been leading that game. We had single coverage on the edge all night long and we were exploiting it. Our game plan was just fine.

 

[Thawki]

duffman is right. You are wrong, hawkeye12345.

The game wasn't out of reach, you are right on that one. The reason it wasn't, though, is because of the play calling that got us back to a tie.

If your type of game were called it would have been much more difficult. We probably wouldn't have come back. Nine times out of ten, more like 99 out of 100, if a team does what we did early in the game they don't come back.

In fact, you would have been ticked off today about the play calling, had KOK actually called things the way you wanted and we lost.

Get a clue, hawkeye12345. We are blind KOK followers because we don't see it your way. Even though your way is a pipe dream.

Whatever.

 

[briankaldenberg]

I questioned it too but at this point in the game KOK has his supporters and no matter what kind of game plan he comes up with (right or wrong) they will make some excuse for him and call you out as being a hater.

I don't care if we were playing from behind or not. The game was never out of reach (see the results) and we shouldn't be playing like it is in the 1st 3 quarters. We are not a deep threat passing team, haven't been since the Chuck Long days, so why try being something that you're not. JH didn't get hurt until late in the game so his injury shouldn't be an excuse either.

One of these days our defense isn't going to be able to bail KOK's butt out on a regular basis and hopefully he hits the road. KOK is a fraud as an O coordinator.

I would agree that KOK is somewhat fraudulent. Our defense and special teams and kicking game are responsible for much of our success during the Ferentz era. Nothing against the guy, but put him on a middle of the pack defensive club such as Purdue, Iowa State, and a very good example would be Northwestern and these teams could kiss bowl games goodbye in my opinion.

 

[MidnightBlueSix]

I questioned it too but at this point in the game KOK has his supporters and no matter what kind of game plan he comes up with (right or wrong) they will make some excuse for him and call you out as being a hater.

I don't care if we were playing from behind or not. The game was never out of reach (see the results) and we shouldn't be playing like it is in the 1st 3 quarters. We are not a deep threat passing team, haven't been since the Chuck Long days, so why try being something that you're not. JH didn't get hurt until late in the game so his injury shouldn't be an excuse either.

One of these days our defense isn't going to be able to bail KOK's butt out on a regular basis and hopefully he hits the road. KOK is a fraud as an O coordinator.

I'm no KOK apologist (at one point last season my fantasy team was named "Let's Go Murder Ken O'Keefe") but 2004 proved he's not a fraud. He gets way too pass happy when we're trailing by more than 10, but his successes are numerous (LSU Capital One Bowl and MSU last year immediately come to mind).

 

[briankaldenberg]

MSU last year immediately come to mind).

What are you talking about? We scored 1 TD in last year's Michigan St. game. We had 276 total yards that game. 276 yards per game right now would put you at 113th nationally in total offense for the 2010 season. We were 5 of 15 on 3rd down that game.

 

[lightning1]

I will say this much about the play calling during the AZ game.
The most inexperienced players on the AZ defense is the LBs and the DEs pin their ears back and try and speed rush most of the time.
It seems to me that 3 step drop and throwing short passes accomplishes 3 things.
#1. It puts pressure on the inexperienced LBs to cover WRs and TEs
#2. It keeps the DEs off of Stanzi and helps the OTs pass protect.
#3. Keeps the LBs from crowding the LOS and eventually opens up the inside running game.

There is always the chance that I dont know what I'm talking about.

 

[hwks1]

KO is a serviceable OC. I don't think anybody is coming after him to steal him from us
The AZ game plan was a mystery. Yes we were upside down from the gun. I still wonder where the TE was? What happened to the jail break screen? We went to the long ball with a QB that has a well documented deficiency of completing longer passes.

 

[WinOneThisCentury]

I will say this much about the play calling during the AZ game.
The most inexperienced players on the AZ defense is the LBs and the DEs pin their ears back and try and speed rush most of the time.
It seems to me that 3 step drop and throwing short passes accomplishes 3 things.
#1. It puts pressure on the inexperienced LBs to cover WRs and TEs
#2. It keeps the DEs off of Stanzi and helps the OTs pass protect.
#3. Keeps the LBs from crowding the LOS and eventually opens up the inside running game.

There is always the chance that I dont know what I'm talking about.

Ok, throwing short routes and playing ball control is all very good and an excellent strategy. Unfortunately that was exactly the thing that Mike Stoops wanted to take away from us. He wasn't going to allow us to run the ball or throw the short routes. He attacked the line of scrimmage with his backers and he played press coverage all night against our wide-outs. The only short pass was the slant and they were contesting that and after McNutt, McTipped the slant pass for six...KOK didn't feel to comfortable there.

Stoops was giving us one thing and he wanted us to throw deep balls and double move patterns all night. It was their weakness and to KOK's credit that is the most I've ever seen him throw deep in my life. We were attacking where the defense was vulnerable, but we didn't make enough big plays and we didn't do it often enough in my humble opinion.

Stoops felt his corners were better than our wideouts. My only gripe was that they got called for bunch of penalties, but they could have called one on every pass play. I think Stoops told his guys to be very physical and the penalties were ok.

Arizona played to win guys and we gave them too many points too easily.

 

[hawkeye12345]

I'll stand by my statement. KOK is a well below average OC and has been very, very fortunate to coach on a team that has a dominant defense.

My only hope is that we learned from our mistakes and stick to what we are good at moving forward.

 

[PlanoHawk]

O'Keefe is awful and if you like him as a hawk fan... well then more power to ya... create a message board screen name in his honor. wait... sorry.

 

[tm3308]

What are you talking about? We scored 1 TD in last year's Michigan St. game. We had 276 total yards that game. 276 yards per game right now would put you at 113th nationally in total offense for the 2010 season. We were 5 of 15 on 3rd down that game.

I think he was probably referring to the final drive. If not, then I would agree with you on this assessment.

But, 2004 did show that he is no fraud. When he's required to get fancy like that, he can do it. But, considering how conservative Ferentz likes to play things, doesn't it make sense that our offensive coordinator isn't Mike Leach? Same goes for Norm. Bend but don't break plays right in with Ferentz's philosophy. He wants vanilla. KOK will give that to you every day of the week. But when he has to do more than that (like in 2004), he's more than capabe of delivering.

I don't agree with everything he calls. But who honestly agrees with EVERY call an OC makes? I do a lot of the same things on Madden and NCAA (not that that really means anything), like running the occassional draw or screen on 3rd and long (granted, it works more often on the video games). That doesn't mean I always agree when we do it on the field. But more often than not, I'm pretty satisfied with the playcalling.

 

[scottsdalehawk]

For the record, I am simply disagreeing with the style of play calling we used. i don't think the fraud language is appropriate but ...

1. yes we got down... but we shouldn't just crap ourselves and throw bombs. I agree with taking shots but we didn't run a slant, a middle screen , try to hit a back out of the back field...

2. on the d taking away the short stuff... give me our big receiver on their little corners.. We do the courtesy nudge to get postion and it is a pretty simple pitch and catch on a slant. With no LBs to support the middle... wow we are missing some easy yardage..

Hopefully when the staff looks at this film they realize they missed some opportunities to move the ball.

 

[CAARHawk]

I think because Arizona was pressing our guys up close, particularly the Tight-ends and daring Iowa to beat them long. The plays were there, but the receivers need to make the play and the line needs to do it's job.

On the last series, you are not talking about huge overloads. You are talking about Gettis getting owned one on one and Vandervelde missing his guy on a loop. Two guards one on one getting their arses handed to them, end of story.