WATN: Bruce Nelson

Mitch Smith must not be an OG Iowegian. Asking a farmer how many acres he works is like shitting on your neighbor's lawn. It makes them super duper butt hurt.

First rule of Farm Club, you do not talk about Farm Club.
 
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Fryowa said:
Mitch Smith must not be an OG Iowegian. Asking a farmer how many acres he works is like shitting on your neighbor's lawn. It makes them super duper butt hurt.

First rule of Farm Club, you do not talk about Farm Club.
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Do you farm? Most farmers I know love talking about that. It's like a measuring stick they like comparing themselves with especially the bigger ones. Now a guy like him probably isn't all that into talking about it due to the public nature of which his name is out there. But I know Adam Timmerman never had that problem when he started buying up land in Cherokee county left and right to over pay for land to buy it up. Those auctions can get competitive and fun to watch. His Dad who has since died and Brother always farmed up there and during Adams career he started buying up a bunch of land up there. Well over 20k acres and probably counting it's been awhile since I've been up there to hear anything new.
 
Hawkfnntn said:
Do you farm? Most farmers I know love talking about that. It's like a measuring stick they like comparing themselves with especially the bigger ones. Now a guy like him probably isn't all that into talking about it due to the public nature of which his name is out there. But I know Adam Timmerman never had that problem when he started buying up land in Cherokee county left and right to over pay for land to buy it up. Those auctions can get competitive and fun to watch. His Dad who has since died and Brother always farmed up there and during Adams career he started buying up a bunch of land up there. Well over 20k acres and probably counting it's been awhile since I've been up there to hear anything new.
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I work with farmers every day. Since I get into finance, they tell me more. However there has been some shift away from jjust giving information. Still they do like to brag. If you don't have 2500 acres today....you are small fry. And in next few years we may lose 25 percent of farmers or more. Not necessarily farm operations (as big of a loss), but how many people a farm operation can support.

Unless a major catastrophe, not seeing the 80s on the horizon, but it is going to be painful. Biggest issue: Lack of working capital which is due in part to not being competitive on machinery cost. This will exert down pressure on the overall Iowa economy.

The level of competition for farm ground to be rented is ferocious. Only the best (not necessarily the highest bidder) will be finalists. Last month saw the first Chapt 7 in our area. Bigger farmer 5-10 k acres.
 
Hawkfnntn said:
Do you farm? Most farmers I know love talking about that. It's like a measuring stick they like comparing themselves with especially the bigger ones. Now a guy like him probably isn't all that into talking about it due to the public nature of which his name is out there. But I know Adam Timmerman never had that problem when he started buying up land in Cherokee county left and right to over pay for land to buy it up. Those auctions can get competitive and fun to watch. His Dad who has since died and Brother always farmed up there and during Adams career he started buying up a bunch of land up there. Well over 20k acres and probably counting it's been awhile since I've been up there to hear anything new.
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I don't farm but I get involved in the business side of it as an addendum to my regular job.

I still live in the area I was born and raised in (45 minutes from Timmerman in Cherokee, incidentally), and around here and many other places I've been most farmers won't admit to the total amount they own (or rent). Land is a commodity and anyone who can multiply can figure out their minimum net worth within a few thousand bucks if the farm is solvent. Sounds old fashioned but welcome to Iowa. Old schoolers don't want you knowing how much they're worth. First of all because farmland in Iowa is a huge pissing match and no one wants to be the little guy. But especially when they complain about Uncle Sam and at the same time collect their gub'ment cheese every year from the Farm Bill.

Now...before this gets crazy I have zero against farmers. I'd play the same game if it were made available to me, and like it or not farming supports a huge part of the economy in Ioway. ANF brotha.
 
Fryowa said:
I don't farm but I get involved in the business side of it as an addendum to my regular job.

I still live in the area I was born and raised in (45 minutes from Timmerman in Cherokee, incidentally), and around here and many other places I've been most farmers won't admit to the total amount they own (or rent). Land is a commodity and anyone who can multiply can figure out their minimum net worth within a few thousand bucks if the farm is solvent. Sounds old fashioned but welcome to Iowa. Old schoolers don't want you knowing how much they're worth. First of all because farmland in Iowa is a huge pissing match and no one wants to be the little guy. But especially when they complain about Uncle Sam and at the same time collect their gub'ment cheese every year from the Farm Bill.

Now...before this gets crazy I have zero against farmers. I'd play the same game if it were made available to me, and like it or not farming supports a huge part of the economy in Ioway. ANF brotha.
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I love farmers. My dad was a not very good one. The gub'ment cheese comment is classic. Iowa, the place where everyone hates Govt handouts ranks near the top in handouts mostly thanks to farmers. Not trying to be brash, but yes ANF, but not as many as they currently have under current production practices. Small organic and low input farmers will increase as the local food thing grows. About 30-40 percent of what Iowa grows has zero to do with food production though. Awh, the fresh fragrance of Iowa ethanol...
 
HawkGold said:
I love farmers. My dad was a not very good one. The gub'ment cheese comment is classic. Iowa, the place where everyone hates Govt handouts ranks near the top in handouts mostly thanks to farmers. Not trying to be brash, but yes ANF, but not as many as they currently have under current production practices. Small organic and low input farmers will increase as the local food thing grows. About 30-40 percent of what Iowa grows has zero to do with food production though. Awh, the fresh fragrance of Iowa ethanol...
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This is a very, very deep rabbit hole. I'll watch the entrance for you ;)
 
Fryowa said:
I don't farm but I get involved in the business side of it as an addendum to my regular job.

I still live in the area I was born and raised in (45 minutes from Timmerman in Cherokee, incidentally), and around here and many other places I've been most farmers won't admit to the total amount they own (or rent). Land is a commodity and anyone who can multiply can figure out their minimum net worth within a few thousand bucks if the farm is solvent. Sounds old fashioned but welcome to Iowa. Old schoolers don't want you knowing how much they're worth. First of all because farmland in Iowa is a huge pissing match and no one wants to be the little guy. But especially when they complain about Uncle Sam and at the same time collect their gub'ment cheese every year from the Farm Bill.

Now...before this gets crazy I have zero against farmers. I'd play the same game if it were made available to me, and like it or not farming supports a huge part of the economy in Ioway. ANF brotha.
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That's cool I grew up south of Cherokee about 20 miles. I can see people taking that side of an angle on things. For sure. We were just around different types of folks it sounds like. I went to a lot of farm auctions growing up and some of them got pretty contentious. The coffee talk I heard every day growing up had people freely talking about what they had and what land they were after. Timmerman himself sure made no bones about it. Everyone just knew everyone and what they had so there just weren't many secrets to be kept really. Your right to include renting it as well because custom farming is a big big deal up there too. There's lots of old money up there where old retired farmers still own a bunch of land yet rent it out to the big guys too. They can't sell it outright because Uncle Sam will tax it to the extent it's crazy. Those families that have owned land forever are smart if they have them in living trusts. Because with the inheritance taxes the way they are you can't hardly even pass it down after dying strait up either.
 
HawkGold said:
I work with farmers every day. Since I get into finance, they tell me more. However there has been some shift away from jjust giving information. Still they do like to brag. If you don't have 2500 acres today....you are small fry. And in next few years we may lose 25 percent of farmers or more. Not necessarily farm operations (as big of a loss), but how many people a farm operation can support.

Unless a major catastrophe, not seeing the 80s on the horizon, but it is going to be painful. Biggest issue: Lack of working capital which is due in part to not being competitive on machinery cost. This will exert down pressure on the overall Iowa economy.

The level of competition for farm ground to be rented is ferocious. Only the best (not necessarily the highest bidder) will be finalists. Last month saw the first Chapt 7 in our area. Bigger farmer 5-10 k acres.
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Yeah what's started happening is the older smaller farmers end up dying off and their heirs begin selling it off to the bigger outfits is pretty much how it's getting to where we are. Only big outfits can afford to gobble it up. The 'family farms' of 500 acres or so are disappearing... Like you said it's the big fish gobbling it all up. All that fancy new techy farm equipment is what allows the big farmers to do so much more in less time it's crazy. Yet no small farmer can afford those toys.
 
Hawkfnntn said:
Yeah what's started happening is the older smaller farmers end up dying off and their heirs begin selling it off to the bigger outfits is pretty much how it's getting to where we are. Only big outfits can afford to gobble it up. The 'family farms' of 500 acres or so are disappearing... Like you said it's the big fish gobbling it all up. All that fancy new techy farm equipment is what allows the big farmers to do so much more in less time it's crazy. Yet no small farmer can afford those toys.
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500 acres? 1500 is average now. In my business, the farms have been going to "smaller" 2,000 acre farmers or a bit bigger rather than the big boys. The really big ones get really upset when they don't get a farm to someone of that size. It is crazy how fast land can be covered. With equipment getting bigger and farmers going out in less than ideal conditions, compaction is a fast growing problem. One problem though is that when there is a fertility problem (no pun intended), it's usually the smaller older ones that you have to watch. Some of that is in part due to the astronomical increase in yields they aren't used to having and it gets away from them real fast. Generally the really big farmers don't cut back on fertilizer. Just some over generalizations.
 
HawkGold said:
500 acres? 1500 is average now. In my business, the farms have been going to "smaller" 2,000 acre farmers or a bit bigger rather than the big boys. The really big ones get really upset when they don't get a farm to someone of that size. It is crazy how fast land can be covered. With equipment getting bigger and farmers going out in less than ideal conditions, compaction is a fast growing problem. One problem though is that when there is a fertility problem (no pun intended), it's usually the smaller older ones that you have to watch. Some of that is in part due to the astronomical increase in yields they aren't used to having and it gets away from them real fast. Generally the really big farmers don't cut back on fertilizer. Just some over generalizations.
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Yeah well like I said those smaller ones are dying off... When I was growing up in the 80s I had lots of friends who's parents farmed too. Most of us were all around 500-800ish acres. Most of us didn't have tractors with a cab on them... We weren't exactly the top of the food chain. When I was 14 we did get an international tractor with one and a bobcat skid loader with a cab. (wasn't heated though still cold as shit in winter) I was the kid considered spoiled rotten amongst my buddies...
 
HawkGold said:
I love farmers. My dad was a not very good one. The gub'ment cheese comment is classic. Iowa, the place where everyone hates Govt handouts ranks near the top in handouts mostly thanks to farmers. Not trying to be brash, but yes ANF, but not as many as they currently have under current production practices. Small organic and low input farmers will increase as the local food thing grows. About 30-40 percent of what Iowa grows has zero to do with food production though. Awh, the fresh fragrance of Iowa ethanol...
Click to expand...


The local/organic will only get so big due to prices that people are willing to pay for food. Also Biggest problem for young farmers wanting to get a start is that it is very difficult with cost of land, equipment and inputs. 2 years ago people could make it work with $7 corn. $3 corn and still high input costs don't bode well for bringing kids back to the family farm. Farming is not an easy or glamorous life style and a lot of the "next generation" find it easier to just move off the farm and make their living working an 8-5
 
hawkfarmer said:
The local/organic will only get so big due to prices that people are willing to pay for food. Also Biggest problem for young farmers wanting to get a start is that it is very difficult with cost of land, equipment and inputs. 2 years ago people could make it work with $7 corn. $3 corn and still high input costs don't bode well for bringing kids back to the family farm. Farming is not an easy or glamorous life style and a lot of the "next generation" find it easier to just move off the farm and make their living working an 8-5
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Farming was pretty glamerous from about 2007 through 2013 or so. Running 1500 acres is not a full time job anymore (need help at harvest and planting). Those 1500 acre farmers at that time were in fact bringing down in NET income 250,000 to 400,000 per year. When there is that much profit to be made, someone's going to figure out how to do it more efficiently. I left the farm years ago. We've been losing farmers for about 120 years do to tech. Input costs have come down along with prices. A say 3000 acre that has expanded their machinery line is at a huge disadvange to the 2200 acre farmer who didn't and doens't have as much new green or red wheeled machines onthe farm.

Unless things turn around there will be fewer farmers in short order. It's sad, but times change. The other thing that has changed is what families will pay for non-factory food. I get my livelihood from normal commercial agriculture but the demographics are changing with younger parents and what they will feed their kids. All you got to do is look at grocery stores outside of really small towns. The Trader Joe's phenomenum is real. Man is that place in Des Moines busy.

I'm not arguing for or against. Looking at it the way it is. I"ve had several customer landowners recently request farmers with only BS degrees to farm the land and have in excess of 5000 acres. I argued with them, particularlyabout the size, but they want operations not overly dependent on them. Really surprised. me.
 
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