Needed and will need more long pass patterns

[uihawk82]

This year, last year and many years the hawk offense fails to stretch the field and put pressure on opposing defenses. This year I think Mcnutt and KMM had the speed to get open deep quite often.

And I am not talking 25-30 yard fade patterns pressed up against the sideline. I am talking about good streak, fly patterns. JVB has shown the ability to rollout and throw a really good pass. Actually he might be better this way.

The facts are opposing defenses constantly crowd our offense, we need to score more TDs, rather than field goals in the red zone, so like in 2002 lets score more over the top and keep their safeties back.

Does Bulloch, KMM, and Davis have the speed to go deep next year and how many of you think we need to do this?

 

[Skeets77]

They pretty much shut down McNutt last night and Davis has questionable hands. I don't know if Iowa has the speed to have much of a pure passing game on long routes and your top teams can easily defend against our lack of speed. It just kills Iowa in general is our lack of speed at skilled offensive positions.

 

[GrandpaHawk]

It takes time to get open on fly and post patterns(usually a double move). If other team blitzes you don't have time.

 

[knighthawk13]

I agree. We definitely need to see more of this. If for nothing else, we need to keep opposing defenses honest. McNutt had plenty of speed to run these routes this year and could have used his height to go up and get the ball.

 

[hawkIhoops]

Good post, but as others have stated, we have to protect long enough to get guys down field. It is puzzling with Martin-Manley and others disappeared given how much attention McNutt got. Most O coordinators would have schemed to make defenses pay for doubling McNutt, but KOK made it seem like the defense had 15 guys on the field. McNutt was our big play guy and I have not seen anything from Davis and KMM to make me think they can fill his shoes.

 

[uihawk82]

Yeah, it may take another second of pass protection to get off a deep pass but I think it is worth trying. Plus if you game plan it correctly you throw these on first down with hard play action to hold the defense and blitz. And occasionally a slight rollout by qb away from pressure. These passes can also be thrown to a spot and they dont have to be double moves, just a straight streak route. The main rule is the qb makes sure the pass is thrown slightly long rather than short so your receiver has got best chance for it. plus with practice these streak patterns turn into 25 to 30 yard back shoulder catches.

 

[DarthKinnick]

Question: How long did it take OU to run go routes?

Question 2: How long would it take Iowa to run go routes?

Is the answer the same to both questions?

NO

There's the "why". They know HOW to do it. But Iowa's glacial velocity at WR dooms us.

 

[MisterLucky]

You mean it isn't against the rules to throw the ball downfield more than 12 yards?!? Does KOK know this?

 

[uihawk82]

I think our receivers can get open on long routes. And the long pass needs to be thrown in 3 seconds anyway to account for the time the ball is in the air.

I thought KMM showed some good quickness and decent speed this year.

Face it, good defenses are putting extra guys in the box and playing man to man on our two main receivers. You have to try to burn them deep a few times to occupy their one remaining safety.

If that safety bails deep the TE should easily be open.

I know KOK tries a few long bombs against some weaker teams but hardly ever against better teams.

 

[bcl20]

I don't disagree but I feel like JVB checked down a lot this year too.

 

[BALDIES7980]

JVB is an avg. college QB. He just really hasn't grown very much as a player. Not a dig at the kid there is only so many that really do develop well and some grow into greatness.
He just locks on to the WR too much and is not real good dealing with pressure.
IMO its clear he is more comfortable in the more open offensive sets. He ran those in HS and he hasn't really taken on the Pro set yet. KF has just got to learn to work harder at putting him in what he is comfortable.(square peg round hole)
Just like Canzeri, if you run the old style two back pro set he would have a chance because of deception but he is going to get killed if they try to use him like they do Coker. Get the kid in positions to be in open space and use his talent.

 

[thetrza]

KOK loves a play called "scissors" where two wide receivers run slants across the middle of the field. It takes forever to develop, but made some big plays in the past two years. KOK has called deep passes with JC and Stanzi at QB, Vandy just isn't making the throws.

Opposing teams study the four or five most common route combinations we run, and read them like a book on gameday. Short stuff or deep throws, it doesn't matter. The plays are average plays run by an average players that only do well against bad defenses.

Long passes just mean long interceptions most of the time.

 

[RocknRollface]

KOK loves a play called "scissors" where two wide receivers run slants across the middle of the field. It takes forever to develop, but made some big plays in the past two years. KOK has called deep passes with JC and Stanzi at QB, Vandy just isn't making the throws.

Opposing teams study the four or five most common route combinations we run, and read them like a book on gameday. Short stuff or deep throws, it doesn't matter. The plays are average plays run by an average players that only do well against bad defenses.

Long passes just mean long interceptions most of the time.

This is the correct answer, its just not very hard to scout Iowa. What we run is far less complicated than most teams.

Drops have also been a huge, huge issue this year, that for some reason, people seem to be ignoring. Iowa was #1 in the conference in drops. We must have had atleast 8 drops agaisnt OU. Davis probably had 5 himself.

 

[RocknRollface]

They pretty much shut down McNutt last night and Davis has questionable hands. I don't know if Iowa has the speed to have much of a pure passing game on long routes and your top teams can easily defend against our lack of speed. It just kills Iowa in general is our lack of speed at skilled offensive positions.

It has nothing to do with lack of speed.

McNutt and Davis are just as fast as OUs receivers. Dropped passes are a legit issue however.

Speed is not a big issue at wide out.

Iowa cold have Mike Wallace out there and it wouldn't make a bit of difference.

The average 40 time of an NFL wide out is 4.5. McNutt probably runs a shade slower than that and Davis is around 4.45.

The way Iowas offense is set up is just very easy to defend unless we have a dominate running game.

Iowa also refuses to play to Vandeburgs strengths which are a fast paced shotgun spread sets. Hes not a drop back QB and yet there are times when we actualy have no running back in the game and still go under center.

They made the identical mistake with Drew Tate.

 

[GrandpaHawk]

They tried in the Bowl game and JV didn't have time to get it off.Rather see them try it on 1st or 2nd down not on 3rd down when we need 10yds.You know def. is coming after you if it's 3rd and long.

 

[ryno]

This is the correct answer, its just not very hard to scout Iowa. What we run is far less complicated than most teams.

Drops have also been a huge, huge issue this year, that for some reason, people seem to be ignoring. Iowa was #1 in the conference in drops. We must have had atleast 8 drops agaisnt OU. Davis probably had 5 himself.

Could not agree more. Our offense is stuck in the 1980's and our receivers dropped the most balls that i can ever remember. Part of that goes on the qb as well. If you throw the ball late over the middle and your receiver gets blown up, drops are much more common. The receiver gets blamed and the qb gets a free pass so to speak.

 

[thetrza]

You need to be efficient in the short stuff before you can expect any success or element of surprise in the long stuff. Short throws to tight ends, or screen passes to deal with aggressive pass rushes.

We run that stretch running play to the edge to set up a play action or quarterback rollout with longer developing routes. If the opposing defense stuffs the stretch run play, all of a sudden there are no long throw plays to even bother attempting.

 

[hawkeye2011]

I actually think differently.

Our passing game is predicated by the intermediate and longer routes.

We need a more systematic method of getting receivers open vs man coverage and a better short (quick game).

I would like to see more screen passes and bunch formations to create rubs to open guys up. Some option routes with somebody with some wiggle.

We will have better personnel with canzeri and Bullock to do this.

Our traditional receivers are more striders. They may have good top end speed but aren't very good at exploding out of breaks and have a hard time shaking free of man coverage even with their physical size.

Canzeri and Bullock will provide something else in the screen and playing in the slot.

Do we need to take our shots down the field? Absolutely. We usually do off play action. But when your run game is as pitiful as ours was against good defenses play action loses some of its effectiveness.

We need to better may of developing rhythm offensively. The short, quick passing game and a more elaborate screen package would accomplish that.

So would creating better match ups for man coverage using cjf and smaller quicker receivers in the slot (JC/DB).

Free up our striders by compressing formations to create some rubs and drag underneath.

Also it's ridiculous to assume you are always going to throw to the sticks or past on 3rd down. Sometimes you need to get the ball in a playmakers hands in space and let them do work. On third and long you have a statistically better opportunity of converting than just chucking it deep.

 

[gravel801]

This is the correct answer, its just not very hard to scout Iowa. What we run is far less complicated than most teams.

Drops have also been a huge, huge issue this year, that for some reason, people seem to be ignoring. Iowa was #1 in the conference in drops. We must have had atleast 8 drops agaisnt OU. Davis probably had 5 himself.

This was absolutely HUGE this year, I don't think it can be overstated how much impact this had on the team's success this season. Most dropped passes I can remember in a very long time, at least since Herb Grigsby was on the team.