Time to Move Central Iowa 4A Substate Basketball Games to College Arenas

[troy]

It's time to move 4A Substate basketball games in Central Iowa to college venues like Hilton Coliseum and the Knapp Center instead of squeezing thousands of fans into high school gyms. Parking and seating would be much improved, and the host high schools could figure out a creative way to share the profits.

 

[bkim24]

takes away from the atmosphere IMO

 

[Stogy]

Agreed. Reminds me of the time in 2004 where I had to work security for Normal West HS as they hosted a sectional tournament. Gym was a decent size but did not have the capacity needed. The final included two top 10 schools in the state - Bartonville Limestone vs Peoria High. This was Shaun Livingston's senior year and the crowd was absolutely nuts. Never happened again.

 

[tm3308]

takes away from the atmosphere IMO

Agreed. I went to the 2007 2A substate game between Nodaway Valley (#1, defending state champs) and Pella Christian (#2) at Valley High. That gym was PACKED, easily the best atmosphere for a high school game I've ever seen.

 

[MedHawk08]

I also love the atmosphere of a gym that's packed to the rafters. As a former high school player, just thinking about playing in that atmosphere gives me chills. When I think substate, that is the environment I want to play in every time and I really wouldn't care if a few hundred more people weren't able to get in. Play the game at half full college arena completely sucks the atmosphere away. Also, small schools can pack the gym better than 4A schools many times. The whole town will often be at these games, whereas metro schools generally don't get that type of community support (emphasis on the word "generally").

 

[wartknight]

They have had some substate games at the Knapp Center over the past few years.
Atmosphere at Hilton or Carver for a HS game would be like the state tourney=sucks

 

[Hawkeye11en1]

As a 2A school we filled Johnston's gym in our substate game, so I can only imagine how bad it is for 4A schools.

 

[troy]

Agreed. I went to the 2007 2A substate game between Nodaway Valley (#1, defending state champs) and Pella Christian (#2) at Valley High. That gym was PACKED, easily the best atmosphere for a high school game I've ever seen.

I agree that 1A, 2A, and 3A should stay in high school gyms, but not 4A, for the reasons I stated above. Watch the 4A games this week. In other areas of the state, they use larger venues, but you won't be able to find a seat for a CIML Substate unless you show up an hour early.

 

[bandgrocks]

I agree that 1A, 2A, and 3A should stay in high school gyms, but not 4A, for the reasons I stated above. Watch the 4A games this week. In other areas of the state, they use larger venues, but you won't be able to find a seat for a CIML Substate unless you show up an hour early.

Typically see a lot of games played at US Cellular Arena in CR. They can do this because there is no team playing at US Cellular. Hilton would be to big, and why would you send a game between Waukee/Valley, Hoover/Urbandale or Ankeny/SE Polk to Ames. This doesn't make sense from a travel standpoint, and throw in the fact they can't even fill the lower ring at Wells Fargo, Hilton would look empty. The other problem you run into is the Big 10 and Big 12 are not done with the regular season, so they are still playing games next week. The Knapp Center would make the most sense in DSM from a size standpoint, but parking is terrible.

Biggest issue - the boys union sets their dates before the Big 10/Big 12 ever set there conference schedules, so it's difficult to plan locations like Carver/Hilton when they don't know when they'll be playing. Other issue is weather, what happens if the games were postponed and the next night you have the college team hosting a game, then you are scrambling to find a location.

Let them play at the high schools, as long as it's a neutral location. You can't be the atmosphere with a bunch of people packed into a high school gym.

 

[Hawkeye11en1]

I got to play Brandon Myers in my substate game in Johnston...gym was packed. It was awesome. He dropped like 35 and we lost in double OT.

 

[troy]

I got to play Brandon Myers in my substate game in Johnston...gym was packed. It was awesome. He dropped like 35 and we lost in double OT.

I think I remember attending that game. Bondurant? Was Dunham a freshman that year? I believe that was one of the all-time best high school games that I have seen.

 

[troy]

Typically see a lot of games played at US Cellular Arena in CR. They can do this because there is no team playing at US Cellular. Hilton would be to big, and why would you send a game between Waukee/Valley, Hoover/Urbandale or Ankeny/SE Polk to Ames. This doesn't make sense from a travel standpoint, and throw in the fact they can't even fill the lower ring at Wells Fargo, Hilton would look empty. The other problem you run into is the Big 10 and Big 12 are not done with the regular season, so they are still playing games next week. The Knapp Center would make the most sense in DSM from a size standpoint, but parking is terrible.

Biggest issue - the boys union sets their dates before the Big 10/Big 12 ever set there conference schedules, so it's difficult to plan locations like Carver/Hilton when they don't know when they'll be playing. Other issue is weather, what happens if the games were postponed and the next night you have the college team hosting a game, then you are scrambling to find a location.

Let them play at the high schools, as long as it's a neutral location. You can't be the atmosphere with a bunch of people packed into a high school gym.

Good points. Those games you mentioned are going to be packed with people this week.

 

[Hawkeye11en1]

I think I remember attending that game. Bondurant? Was Dunham a freshman that year? I believe that was one of the all-time best high school games that I have seen.

Yup, he was our 6th man (we knew we had something special in him, even then. He just wasn't confident enough yet.). Awesome that you were there. It was freakin amazing. We had them down the WHOLE game, then Myers went off late....the game, crowd...everything...my all-time favorite memory of playing high school ball.

 

[loesshillshawk]

It's time to move 4A Substate basketball games in Central Iowa to college venues like Hilton Coliseum and the Knapp Center instead of squeezing thousands of fans into high school gyms. Parking and seating would be much improved, and the host high schools could figure out a creative way to share the profits.

From an Athletic Directors stand point it can and will never happen. Schools get a cut of the gate when they host a tournament game (although it is not huge) and get all the concessions which is huge. The atmosphere is also lost so don't look for that to happen anytime soon.

 

[Bowlhawk]

Agreed. I went to the 2007 2A substate game between Nodaway Valley (#1, defending state champs) and Pella Christian (#2) at Valley High. That gym was PACKED, easily the best atmosphere for a high school game I've ever seen.

I was there! Agreed, great game and fantastic atmosphere. Only bad thing is they had to have turned people away as we got there at least 40 minutes before tipoff and had to pack in one of the top corners. Knapp Center would have been nice for capacities sake.

 

[Lionhawk]

I am sorry but have to disagree with using the Knapp Center for the smaller schools. Maybe it would work for the larger schools due to sheer size but packed gyms add more atmosphere than do venues that are only 3/4 full.

During Meyer's junior year, PCM played Pella at the Knapp Center for a regular season game. That was the year Kyle Korver and Pierce Hibma were seniors at Pella. I think Pella was #1 in 3A while PCM entered the game like #3 in 2A. There was a huge crowd on hand and the players loved playing at the Knapp Center but the atmosphere wasn't the same as it had been in the Pella gym the year prior or the following year. Don't get me wrong, it was a great atmosphere but it wasn't the same.

There was talk the following year, Meyer's senior year, of moving the Bondo/PCM game to another venue as everyone knew Urbandale's gym wasn't near big enough but no other venue was available that night.

I can understand the issues when the 4A schools are involved but when it is the smaller schools I think the atmosphere would fall apart in the huge venues.

 

[Schneid]

Since Knapp's parking is a pain, I think the best thing would be setting up Wells Fargo Arena like they do for Energy games. Curtain off the upper deck and just use the bottom bowl. The curtain helps keep the venue less cavernous and the sound could still be a small factor. I don't know the exact specks, but the capacity would likely be at least 8,000. The parking garages would offer a better parking situation.

One person mentioned that schools get a small kickback from the games. Well maybe Hoover and North NEED the concessions and the VERY small kickback, but the bigger schools and burbs would probably benefit more by keeping boosters happy with the experience at the venue. IMO, burbs and others would benefit most if they could get the venue for a reasonable price and surrender concession rights. The venue could possibly be affordable, especially if they don't have to spend money to change their setup from the Energy games. Just a thought.

 

[Hawkeye11en1]

There was talk the following year, Meyer's senior year, of moving the Bondo/PCM game to another venue as everyone knew Urbandale's gym wasn't near big enough but no other venue was available that night.

It was in Johnston. But never knew there was talk of moving it.

Edit: you are probley talking about the year after. Not sure where that game was played

 

[thejumper5]

I am sorry but have to disagree with using the Knapp Center for the smaller schools. Maybe it would work for the larger schools due to sheer size but packed gyms add more atmosphere than do venues that are only 3/4 full.

During Meyer's junior year, PCM played Pella at the Knapp Center for a regular season game. That was the year Kyle Korver and Pierce Hibma were seniors at Pella. I think Pella was #1 in 3A while PCM entered the game like #3 in 2A. There was a huge crowd on hand and the players loved playing at the Knapp Center but the atmosphere wasn't the same as it had been in the Pella gym the year prior or the following year. Don't get me wrong, it was a great atmosphere but it wasn't the same.

There was talk the following year, Meyer's senior year, of moving the Bondo/PCM game to another venue as everyone knew Urbandale's gym wasn't near big enough but no other venue was available that night.

I can understand the issues when the 4A schools are involved but when it is the smaller schools I think the atmosphere would fall apart in the huge venues.

I think you have your Korvers mixed up. Meyer was a JR in '03, Kyle Korver graduated Pella in '99.

 

[bandgrocks]

Since Knapp's parking is a pain, I think the best thing would be setting up Wells Fargo Arena like they do for Energy games. Curtain off the upper deck and just use the bottom bowl. The curtain helps keep the venue less cavernous and the sound could still be a small factor. I don't know the exact specks, but the capacity would likely be at least 8,000. The parking garages would offer a better parking situation.

One person mentioned that schools get a small kickback from the games. Well maybe Hoover and North NEED the concessions and the VERY small kickback, but the bigger schools and burbs would probably benefit more by keeping boosters happy with the experience at the venue. IMO, burbs and others would benefit most if they could get the venue for a reasonable price and surrender concession rights. The venue could possibly be affordable, especially if they don't have to spend money to change their setup from the Energy games. Just a thought.

Just don't see this happening in a substate final game. I can't believe the boys union would allow for teams to play on the floor where the state tourney is going to be played the following week. Yes, there are a few high school games played at the Well, but they are not substate final games.

BTW - Hoover packs their gym for boys games, so the loss of revenue/concessions would impact them. And for those schools in the burbs, I'd bet most of them would rather play in a high school gym vs. the Well. I'm sorry, but there is no atmosphere at the Well for basketball.