Loved the latest Miller/Deace Podcast evaluating the Iowa program

HaydenHawk56

HaydenHawk56

Well-Known Member
https://www.hawkeyenation.com/miller-deace/hn-podcast-iowa-hoops-at-the-b1g-halfway-point

I think Steve really nailed it on the head. The IA Basketball Program, under Fran, is basically brought Iowa back to its baseline expectation under the Mr. Davis years.....but without all the good things you like about the years under Mr. Davis (or before him). We are competitive, but we are not a significant team in college basketball. No #1 rankings, no Elite 8s, no Sweet sixteens, etc. No big time Iowa star player to follow in the NBA. Fran's biggest accomplishment is bringing the program back to baseline after Steve Alford killed and then Todd Lickliter buried the program. This is where we are at in 9 years. Coupled with the fact we have Barta still as AD and as an Iowa fan you can feel, meh.....and feel like the program you follow is being held hostage.

Just felt this podcast did a great job of capturing the feelings many could have right now.
 
With so many college BB programs, lots of them have to be average. It allows the elite teams to fill out their schedule each year.

Here we are.
 
HaydenHawk56 said:
https://www.hawkeyenation.com/miller-deace/hn-podcast-iowa-hoops-at-the-b1g-halfway-point

I think Steve really nailed it on the head. The IA Basketball Program, under Fran, is basically brought Iowa back to its baseline expectation under the Mr. Davis years.....but without all the good things you like about the years under Mr. Davis (or before him). We are competitive, but we are not a significant team in college basketball. No #1 rankings, no Elite 8s, no Sweet sixteens, etc. No big time Iowa star player to follow in the NBA. Fran's biggest accomplishment is bringing the program back to baseline after Steve Alford killed and then Todd Lickliter buried the program. This is where we are at in 9 years. Coupled with the fact we have Barta still as AD and as an Iowa fan you can feel, meh.....and feel like the program you follow is being held hostage.

Just felt this podcast did a great job of capturing the feelings many could have right now.
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I'm not sure why Deace gets some of the bad rap that he does. He breaks down sports angles as objectively using logic as much as anyone out there. He is very self aware of biases yet he calls things how he sees it. I enjoy hearing his takes too.
 
Hawkfnntn said:
I'm not sure why Deace gets some of the bad rap that he does. He breaks down sports angles as objectively using logic as much as anyone out there. He is very self aware of biases yet he calls things how he sees it. I enjoy hearing his takes too.
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Some people can see past his politics.

I too like his sports takes, even when I don't always agree with him.
 
PCHawk said:
Fran is identical to Davis. The only difference is where the program was when they took over.
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Oh, I don't know about that. I don't think Fran could hold Mr. Davis's coaching jock strap. Mr. Davis is the far better coach xs and os wise. Recruiting, they could be more even there. Even then, Mr. Davis brought in some more capable point guards (Woolridge, Oliver, come to mind).

Mr. Davis had an Elite 8 at I believe at Boston College before he came to Iowa.
 
PCHawk said:
Fran is identical to Davis. The only difference is where the program was when they took over.
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No way. Even if you take out Mr. Davis's first 4 years (Ravs' recruits), Mr. Davis made the NCAA 6 times in the next 9 years, winning 7 NCAA game and made a sweet 16. He had a team that was a 4 seed, a 5 seed, a 6 seed in those 6 NCAA appearances.

Franny hasn't come close to this kind of production.
 
HaydenHawk56 said:
Oh, I don't know about that. I don't think Fran could hold Mr. Davis's coaching jock strap. Mr. Davis is the far better coach xs and os wise. Recruiting, they could be more even there. Even then, Mr. Davis brought in some more capable point guards (Woolridge, Oliver, come to mind).

Mr. Davis had an Elite 8 at I believe at Boston College before he came to Iowa.
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It's hard to say for sure because we will never know how Davis would have done with a terrible team and we will never know how Fran could have done (from the start) if he would have inherited a great team.
 
HaydenHawk56 said:
https://www.hawkeyenation.com/miller-deace/hn-podcast-iowa-hoops-at-the-b1g-halfway-point

I think Steve really nailed it on the head. The IA Basketball Program, under Fran, is basically brought Iowa back to its baseline expectation under the Mr. Davis years.....but without all the good things you like about the years under Mr. Davis (or before him). We are competitive, but we are not a significant team in college basketball. No #1 rankings, no Elite 8s, no Sweet sixteens, etc. No big time Iowa star player to follow in the NBA. Fran's biggest accomplishment is bringing the program back to baseline after Steve Alford killed and then Todd Lickliter buried the program. This is where we are at in 9 years. Coupled with the fact we have Barta still as AD and as an Iowa fan you can feel, meh.....and feel like the program you follow is being held hostage.

Just felt this podcast did a great job of capturing the feelings many could have right now.
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".....but without all the good things you like about the years under Mr. Davis (or before him)."

This would make Fran significantly worse than Mr. Davis!
 
deanvogs said:
No way. Even if you take out Mr. Davis's first 4 years (Ravs' recruits), Mr. Davis made the NCAA 6 times in the next 9 years, winning 7 NCAA game and made a sweet 16. He had a team that was a 4 seed, a 5 seed, a 6 seed in those 6 NCAA appearances.

Franny hasn't come close to this kind of production.
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Iowa was a way better program back then tho. That has to count for something. If Fran makes the tourney this year, it will be 4 of the last 6. At worst he's a hair behind Davis.
 
Hawkfnntn said:
I'm not sure why Deace gets some of the bad rap that he does. He breaks down sports angles as objectively using logic as much as anyone out there. He is very self aware of biases yet he calls things how he sees it. I enjoy hearing his takes too.
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I've always been a fan of him.
 
PCHawk said:
It's hard to say for sure because we will never know how Davis would have done with a terrible team and we will never know how Fran could have done (from the start) if he would have inherited a great team.
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In addition, it is quite a different game now compared to 1987. You've got players playing away from the hoop instead of inside outside, you've got 6'10" players shooting 3 pt shots when open, most everybody can dribble at a high level instead of a primary PG like it was 30 yrs ago. Youth sports are so much better that these players come up with an overall game and every kid grows up shooting the 3 as they like them the best. Youth teams usually play a 5 man out offense, spread the court pass and cut. A "true" motion offense is not usually ran now. It is all about spread, spacing, cutting and the outside shot.

Presses aren't as effective now as far as creating turnovers secondary to the better ball handling by all players. It is still ran some, but to mostly eat up the shot clock to leave a team 12 seconds left. You just don't see a full court hard press anymore like Tom Davis's teams played. Too many ball handlers on the floor and they would break it for layups 75% of the time.

Just my $0.02.
 
MelroseHawkins said:
Fortunately for me, my political thoughts and ideologies run pretty parallel with Deace's.
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What's funny is I listen to him all the time and I know he's extreme politically one way or the other, but for some reason I've never figured out which way he leans. I guess I just block it out. So is he right or left?
 
deanvogs said:
No way. Even if you take out Mr. Davis's first 4 years (Ravs' recruits), Mr. Davis made the NCAA 6 times in the next 9 years, winning 7 NCAA game and made a sweet 16. He had a team that was a 4 seed, a 5 seed, a 6 seed in those 6 NCAA appearances.

Franny hasn't come close to this kind of production.
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Not so sure about that. Fran makes one deep run in the tournament and he gets Tom Davis, Lute Olsen type status.

Maybe that's indictment on Iowa basketball in general. The NCAA tournament is a crap shoot. Fran could get a 6 or a 7 seed in this year's tournament, get to the elite 8 and you are singing a different tune. That scenario is plausible now more than ever. Yes, a blue blood will win the national title. But it is easier for non blue bloods to make a deep run in the tournament.
 
trj said:
Not so sure about that. Fran makes one deep run in the tournament and he gets Tom Davis, Lute Olsen type status.

Maybe that's indictment on Iowa basketball in general. The NCAA tournament is a crap shoot. Fran could get a 6 or a 7 seed in this year's tournament, get to the elite 8 and you are singing a different tune. That scenario is plausible now more than ever. Yes, a blue blood will win the national title. But it is easier for non blue bloods to make a deep run in the tournament.
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I'm not even sure we will ultimately make the NCAA tournament even this year. Lets just make the NCAA to begin with then you can start talking "Elite 8's". :) .
 
trj said:
Not so sure about that. Fran makes one deep run in the tournament and he gets Tom Davis, Lute Olsen type status.

Maybe that's indictment on Iowa basketball in general. The NCAA tournament is a crap shoot. Fran could get a 6 or a 7 seed in this year's tournament, get to the elite 8 and you are singing a different tune. That scenario is plausible now more than ever. Yes, a blue blood will win the national title. But it is easier for non blue bloods to make a deep run in the tournament.
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I would give Fran his due if he were to accomplish that. It would mean he would have his team clicking enough on all cylinders as they would likely have to topple some tangible team in route to the Elite 8.....unless they were extremely lucky with upsets along the way.

That said, Iowa has to start looking like an NCAA tournament team again, or they will not get out of their first game. I think Iowa is at least 65-70% likely to make it as there are enough winable games left to get there. But, I think it is a very short stay at this point if we bring that piss poor defensive show we brought to the Barn.
 
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