Heads rolling today....

Luftgekuehlt67

Well-Known Member
Haha, yee who is without shit throw the first turd.

It is a discussion board yet if some posters on here deviate from your logic just a bit you 'fry' them to a crisp. Just let the discussion roll and ideas will be cleared out at the end of the season.
I normally like your takes UI, but the problem is the same merry band of dorks will be back next year trotting out the same tired tropes (well, in the meantime, a bunch of them will be spouting similar nonsense on the hoops board).

So, no, the ideas won't be "cleared out at the end of the season". They'll just begin writing the 2022 edition of "Kirk Ferentz is taking this program down from the inside" or whatever it is they think is going on.
 

Knight78

Well-Known Member
One only needs to look at ISU (I know, I know...) to see what our fortunes could be. ISU is in a P5 conference and is in a state with very few FBS recruits, just like Iowa. It's not particularly easy to recruit to Iowa or ISU for a number of reasons, thus the reason neither team tends to get many 4 star recruits and virtually no 5 star recruits. (AJE was the rare exception, due to his being a legacy.) And under Campbell both programs are "developmental" programs; neither of us can simply "reload" or "plug and play" with our recruits.

Since Earle Bruce had three straight 8 win seasons ending in 1978 and left for tOSU, ISU has had a carousel of losers. Donnie Duncan (18-24-2) for 4 years, Jim Criner (16-20) for 4 years, Jim Walden (28-57-3) for 8 years, Dan McCarney (56-85) for 12 years, Gene Chizik (7-17) for 2 years and Paul Rhoads (32-73) for 7 years. They finally hit their "needle in a haystack" with Matt Campbell (41-31) in 2016. That's 38 years.

Now, for those of us who remember, how long did Iowa suffer before Hayden?
 

Fryowa

Administrator
Fuck that. You, Fryowa are the problem.
See but I’m not the problem. Literally nothing I do affects a single thing with the Iowa program. Whatsoever.


Typical Iowa fan base. Same as the damn Cubs fan base. mediocrity is cool. 8-4 with an occasional 10 win season and warm weather bowls.

Fuck that. You, Fryowa are the problem. You accept the shit Iowa throws at you. Think how shitty a tema we would be without Phil Parker. We would be a Bob Commings type program. If our defense wasnt top 10 we would win 4 game s a year.

Oh yeah, what would happen if we got rid of KF? We could be bad? sure. But we could be better. But you KF supporters always look on the negative side. We have the best coach we can get. Yet Bobby Stoops wanted to coach here.

Stupidity that you think a 100+ ranked offense is okay because "we cant get anyone better" . BULLSHIT

You hawk fans remind me of a stretch play to the short side of the field on 3rd and 15. Stupid.
News flash, Einstein, mediocrity would be a below .500 record. Which is what nebraska now has because their admin gave into clueless fans like yourself who couldn’t comprehend the fact that coaching staff changes are almost always not an improvement and in most cases end up with worse performance than the predecessors, especially if they were fired for bad performance.

Our program is not mediocre by any standard but your delusional one. I seriously think you’re a guy who would keep losing his ass gambling because you thought the odds eventually had to swing in your favor.

1% of me actually wants the Hawks to fire the Ferentzes and get some flashy unknown staff in here so you can see how bad of a thing that’s likely to be, so I can say I told you so when the team is 2-10 and we’re on the nebraska coaching carousel. But then the other 99% of comes to my senses.

If you can’t live with 8 wins from a below freezing midwestern small town with no recruiting advantages or history of major success you should probably find a different team because that’s the average ceiling. There’s a team 5 hours west on I80 that would love to have you because all of ‘em share the same delusion as you. Lots of like minds over there.
 

kicker22

Well-Known Member
So my take...
What do any of these programs benefit from firing a coach mid season? The likely suitor, unless hiring from within, is still most likely coaching somewhere else and would be until bowl season starts at the very earliest. If you then fire them immediately after the season it almost puts the hiring process in overdrive as they scramble to find "the right guy" and get his staff in place before spring ball.

Either option is feasible if a change has to be made, but if the right candidate isn't out there or isn't interested then what? You almost have to take a gamble or settle for someone that may be closest to the fit that is desired.

My thought with a coach like KF. Unless the next HC has been decided and is currently available (and a sure thing) you stay put knowing exactly what KF is going to give you. You let their contract play out or let them decide when its their time to go. This buys you enough time to find the right candidate and put together the right team to find the next HC. We've had 2 coaches in 40+ years, it's not something we do on a regular basis so you need to get the ducks lined up in a row. Are we really comfortable with Barta making that decision or does he need to go first?
 

NCHawker

Well-Known Member
It's very simple.

Yet it's something that folks can't seem to grasp for whatever reason. Just like if I told someone that the probability of flipping a coin for 1,000 straight heads is the exact same as any other random combination. You can show people math and facts, but it doesn't register because they get blinded by either stupidity or the hubris of thinking their team (a la nebraska) is much more relevant than it actually is.

The simple fact is this...coaching changes end up with worse results way more often than not, and at the very best they replicate the same poor results. Only in a VERY few instances does a coaching staff come in and improve things, and even rarer yet is it that a staff comes in and improves on a staff with a WP north of .700. To do that would require luck akin to winning the lottery.

That's all fine and dandy if you're a team with a garbage record, or a lot of scandal, or you're already playing musical coaches. But if you aren't...if you're an Iowa team that has had 42 years of stability, been relatively scandal-free, has a rabid regional fanbase, and success that many teams would kill for (yes, more programs than not would love to be in our shoes whether you're happy with it or not), it's monumentally stupid.

Essentially what you're doing by saying you want a different staff is equivalent to,"I've spent $1,000 on scratch tickets but only broken even. I'm going to buy $1,000 more because surely I'll win this time." Because of hubris, you've completely ignored the fact that you've been unbelievably lucky to break even. And even dumber yet you think the odds of better success are in your favor (which they are absolutely not).

Truly elite coaching staffs are not assembled with skill. Elite coaching staffs are a product of luck that makes administration look like they knew what they were doing, as well as recruiting power. Iowa does not have recruiting power, so that leaves luck. And terrible odds.

At many schools, especially in the SEC there is a lively if not toxic booster influence. The AD is often a puppet and being pulled in many directions. They make investments in recruiting, hard cash, and they want results and a voice. These jerks fancy themselves as little Jerry Jones'.

Gus Malzon remarked after joining UCF, "they have alignment" here. And in places where alignment is not present you have disorder and coaching churn.

I'm sure Iowa's boosters are engaged but there is alignment.
 

uihawk82

Well-Known Member
So my take...
What do any of these programs benefit from firing a coach mid season? The likely suitor, unless hiring from within, is still most likely coaching somewhere else and would be until bowl season starts at the very earliest. If you then fire them immediately after the season it almost puts the hiring process in overdrive as they scramble to find "the right guy" and get his staff in place before spring ball.

Either option is feasible if a change has to be made, but if the right candidate isn't out there or isn't interested then what? You almost have to take a gamble or settle for someone that may be closest to the fit that is desired.

My thought with a coach like KF. Unless the next HC has been decided and is currently available (and a sure thing) you stay put knowing exactly what KF is going to give you. You let their contract play out or let them decide when its their time to go. This buys you enough time to find the right candidate and put together the right team to find the next HC. We've had 2 coaches in 40+ years, it's not something we do on a regular basis so you need to get the ducks lined up in a row. Are we really comfortable with Barta making that decision or does he need to go first?

You have some good points but as far as looking at new coaches an AD can call the agents of various coaches to find out if they would be interested and how interested in moving to Iowa. Every AD should always have a short list of top candidates for their head football coaching job.

The next point, and it may not hurt Iowa as much as a Bama or other blue blood, is when your head coach is getting pretty old the other teams will use that against you in recruiting by telling recruits that Coach So and So will not be there all 5 years you will be playing there. That is why you see more and more schools name an assistant head coach in waiting. Now since Iowa doesnt get a bunch of 4 and 5 star recruits this topic might not affect recruiting for the hawks as much as when Saban gets to be 75!!!!!
 

Fryowa

Administrator
So my take...
What do any of these programs benefit from firing a coach mid season? The likely suitor, unless hiring from within, is still most likely coaching somewhere else and would be until bowl season starts at the very earliest. If you then fire them immediately after the season it almost puts the hiring process in overdrive as they scramble to find "the right guy" and get his staff in place before spring ball.

Either option is feasible if a change has to be made, but if the right candidate isn't out there or isn't interested then what? You almost have to take a gamble or settle for someone that may be closest to the fit that is desired.

My thought with a coach like KF. Unless the next HC has been decided and is currently available (and a sure thing) you stay put knowing exactly what KF is going to give you. You let their contract play out or let them decide when its their time to go. This buys you enough time to find the right candidate and put together the right team to find the next HC. We've had 2 coaches in 40+ years, it's not something we do on a regular basis so you need to get the ducks lined up in a row. Are we really comfortable with Barta making that decision or does he need to go first?
With football Barta does not make that decision. Large donors do. And they love KF, so by default he's his own AD. When KF decides it's his time to go, he's going to have a whole lot of say on who the next coach is and the donors will trust him.

Like I've said before, Farta is there to oversee golf and boat racing, act as a scapegoat when things go south, and raise money. Football is off limits and Barta is a puppet governor.
 

Casualfan

Well-Known Member
One other thing...

If you guys think recruiting is tough for Iowa, wait till you rubes get rid of the Ferentzes.

At that point we're just a program in the Arctic circle starting its program over. Good luck.

This is like staying with women (3) and not thinking you can get a 7. Obviously a 10 is out of the question ya rube.
 

Fryowa

Administrator
This is like staying with women (3) and not thinking you can get a 7. Obviously a 10 is out of the question ya rube.
Like a typical nebraska fan, you’re underestimating the coaches you have and grossly overestimating the women you could actually pull.
 

Northside Hawk

Well-Known Member
One only needs to look at ISU (I know, I know...) to see what our fortunes could be. ISU is in a P5 conference and is in a state with very few FBS recruits, just like Iowa. It's not particularly easy to recruit to Iowa or ISU for a number of reasons, thus the reason neither team tends to get many 4 star recruits and virtually no 5 star recruits. (AJE was the rare exception, due to his being a legacy.) And under Campbell both programs are "developmental" programs; neither of us can simply "reload" or "plug and play" with our recruits.

Since Earle Bruce had three straight 8 win seasons ending in 1978 and left for tOSU, ISU has had a carousel of losers. Donnie Duncan (18-24-2) for 4 years, Jim Criner (16-20) for 4 years, Jim Walden (28-57-3) for 8 years, Dan McCarney (56-85) for 12 years, Gene Chizik (7-17) for 2 years and Paul Rhoads (32-73) for 7 years. They finally hit their "needle in a haystack" with Matt Campbell (41-31) in 2016. That's 38 years.

Now, for those of us who remember, how long did Iowa suffer before Hayden?
I had forgotten that Jim Walden lasted there eight years. And his winning g % was worse than anyone on that list except Chizik who provided a two year sample size.

Eight years? Jim Walden? That's laughable even by Cyclone standards.
 

Northside Hawk

Well-Known Member
Time for the post I type every football season and every baskettball season.

If Iowa hires the right destination coach, and it seems to have two at the present time, there is probably going to be a ceiling on what our programs can accomplish. And to some consistency can look like complacency, even mediocrity, and it can make the coach of the team look as they are comfortable, content with said consistency.

For Iowa to break through the glass ceiling history shows that they have to get a Forrest Evy, Ralph Miller, Lute Olson type who may be doing something else in five years, but who can produce spectacular results while they are here. It would work if you hit the correct hire, but would the alumni and boosters go along with it?
 

Gibsonian

Well-Known Member
One other thing...

If you guys think recruiting is tough for Iowa, wait till you rubes get rid of the Ferentzes.

At that point we're just a program in the Arctic circle starting its program over. Good luck.
I agree with nearly all your points in this thread except doing something about the poor offensive performance. Abysmal under BF, worst in my lifetime if I read this correctly. I'm not saying what change and you don't fire your son or anyone else at 7-2, but if you are not fixing your problems, not attempting to improve your weak spots, then wtf? I don't understand repeating poor performance just because. Ferentz has made changes before and he will again. Miss Okeefe.......
 

cincyhawk

Well-Known Member
Not advocating firing anyone midseason.
But I am curious to know what is the 'cliff' for you? At what point do you agree it's time for a change?
We are, once again this year, among the worst FBS teams in total offense. This year the excuse a poor offensive line, other years its the receivers, or it's poor recruiting, new QB - always something trotted out as an excuse why we are at the bottom of the offense rankings year in / year out.
When in fact we have an offense philosophy that is "defensive" - designed to 'minimize losses'.
I believe we might do better with merely an average offense. But that will require change...
This my question. Forget Ferentz;

@Fryowa at what point in points per game, losses in a row, total losses, records in a row, offensive ranking in a row, etc., should a coach be removed from their duties in your opinion? What are your criteria?
 

cincyhawk

Well-Known Member
Iowa is 7-2 right now, tied for the West lead, and in line for a very good bowl game.

I know this is an internet message board with anonymous posts, but I think people need to remember that Iowa plays in a very tough league and the two teams that defeated us are quality teams. The stability of the Iowa program is attractive to young recruits, and allows Iowa to be successful year after year. I'm very satisfied with Ferentz and his entire coaching staff. I hope Kirk stays for many more years.

I was very encouraged by what I saw during the Northwestern game. Iowa made a QB change and it paid dividends. Northwestern was jazzed up and it was Senior Day for them, and yet we pulled out a big win. A huge win.

We now have 3 winnable games left. I hope Padilla continues to be the starter. He has more upside that Petras, in my humble opinion.
Iowa isn't tied for anything. They lost both of their conference losses in division, which puts them behind Purdue, Minnesota, and Wisconsin in terms of tiebreakers.

This is a 4-way tie. Winning percentage against the 4 tied teams is the first step.

Let's say Iowa and Wisconsin win and Purdue win out and MN loses to Iowa and WI.

Iowa gets third.

If the tie gets to three-loss West teams there's a possibility Iowa would win it... but with 2 losses in division Iowa needs Purdue and WI to drop one more.
 

cincyhawk

Well-Known Member
One only needs to look at ISU (I know, I know...) to see what our fortunes could be. ISU is in a P5 conference and is in a state with very few FBS recruits, just like Iowa. It's not particularly easy to recruit to Iowa or ISU for a number of reasons, thus the reason neither team tends to get many 4 star recruits and virtually no 5 star recruits. (AJE was the rare exception, due to his being a legacy.) And under Campbell both programs are "developmental" programs; neither of us can simply "reload" or "plug and play" with our recruits.

Since Earle Bruce had three straight 8 win seasons ending in 1978 and left for tOSU, ISU has had a carousel of losers. Donnie Duncan (18-24-2) for 4 years, Jim Criner (16-20) for 4 years, Jim Walden (28-57-3) for 8 years, Dan McCarney (56-85) for 12 years, Gene Chizik (7-17) for 2 years and Paul Rhoads (32-73) for 7 years. They finally hit their "needle in a haystack" with Matt Campbell (41-31) in 2016. That's 38 years.

Now, for those of us who remember, how long did Iowa suffer before Hayden?
19 seasons. And it was the longest stretch of. 500 or less football in program history. And involved the toughest OOC slate in program history. Changing to play ISU every year helped to change that.
 

Fryowa

Administrator
This my question. Forget Ferentz;

@Fryowa at what point in points per game, losses in a row, total losses, records in a row, offensive ranking in a row, etc., should a coach be removed from their duties in your opinion? What are your criteria?
There's zero way to answer that question. Every situation is completely different in every way.

I do know that even though I'd be ok with an OC change if we lose the next few games, this Iowa staff is .714 since Brian took over, never missed a bowl game, and never lost a bowl game.

And remember this, rubes...

Brian isn't leaving until Kirk does, and when Kirk leaves we lose Phil Parker, Levar woods, Raimond Braithwaite, and Kelvin Bell. Careful what you wish for.
 

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