Ferentz warns of growing imbalance in college game
- Thread starter SCHawkeye2
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guffus
Well-Known Member
Was there actually 32 teams when Ferentz coached in the NFL?
Zstatman
Well-Known Member
I don't know that KF has to send a warning, I think we all know down deep college athletics is broken right now.
In the financial markets the pundits keep talking about how we have a K shaped economy, those of the up arrow have money and function as normal, as they will, those on the downward pointing side are the ones that are struggling; the price of gas, food, rent, etc all play a part in their daily lives.
The same with college athletics, a K shaped environment; those that have their financial house/NIL in order are doing OK, they can pay their athletes and compete, some better than other. We aren't in that upper echelon but we're doing OK and can compete for the most part, maybe KF is worried how long we can do that.
The schools that don't have enough money? Well, they are on their own...........
In the financial markets the pundits keep talking about how we have a K shaped economy, those of the up arrow have money and function as normal, as they will, those on the downward pointing side are the ones that are struggling; the price of gas, food, rent, etc all play a part in their daily lives.
The same with college athletics, a K shaped environment; those that have their financial house/NIL in order are doing OK, they can pay their athletes and compete, some better than other. We aren't in that upper echelon but we're doing OK and can compete for the most part, maybe KF is worried how long we can do that.
The schools that don't have enough money? Well, they are on their own...........
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FTFY
I don't mean this in a pissy "college is indoctrination" way.
I mean it in an economic, financial, efficiency way.
And also the fact of the demographic cliff that's about to severely kick in.
And I wonder if collegiate sports were always used as an enrollment booster and how much of that is subsidized at the state level or through Pell grants. Those Pell grants, I know, were quite leveraged and some schools were actually able to keep the difference between the Pell grant and the actual cost of the tuition. I gather that ended awhile back. But, they can just increase the "tuition" and lower the cost of their housing and board. Were these smaller private liberal arts colleges that are so much in the red always doing this? I mean....back in the 60s/70s/80s.....or is it a new phenomena?
Also, it's not an immediate crash out concern for schools like Iowa. The hurt is gonna happen lower down the chain first.
Westernhawk
Well-Known Member
Great points. There are a lot of parallels or similarities across industries with this K shaped economy idea.
We are unfortunately moving more and more into a world of haves and have nots. College football is one illustration. Sadly we may see the same 12 blue blood teams at the top all the time. Indiana would've been an aberration, but they have money now.
As you noted, individuals on the upward arrow of the K are not "price sensitive" to gas and groceries. Their investments and properties are doing quite well. It's not so rosy for people who have to work two jobs to get by.
I happen to work in operations for hospitals/health systems. The same "haves" and "have nots" apply here as well. We'll continue to see rural hospitals close in places like Iowa, as they rely on governmental payor sources quite a bit. I work for a top ranked academic health system that is now buying other hospitals at a rapid pace. I'm lucky in my role, but it's kind of a depressing landscape.
I'm sure there are many more examples of the have and have not divide that is widening that others can share as well.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
Football is not innately the best sport. The reason the NFL overtook MLB as America's dominant sport is complex, but a huge part of it was knowing that your team was on the same playing field (literally) as all other teams in the league. In MLB, the Royals are the farm league for the Yankees and Dodgers. Hard to invest in that sort of system.
College sports should take note. I don't know how many different ways we can say the same thing, there needs to be guardrails.
College sports should take note. I don't know how many different ways we can say the same thing, there needs to be guardrails.
The argument saying there is 'greater imbalance' in college football would make a lot more sense if results of recent years bore that out. It defies conventional wisdom, but there's probably been more parity at the top of college football in recent years than in the previous 50. Having the same 12 blue blood teams at the top is a lot better than having the same 2-3. And last year's championship game was between who? Oh yeah -- Indiana and Miami. The chances of that matchup prior to the NIL era? Close to zero.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
All fair. The rise of NIL has opened the door for non-cheating schools in the Big 10 to somewhat even the playing field by paying players fairly and directly. The dark money remains, but it is diminished by the legal money and contracts changing hands. Yes, it is not a coincidence that as soon as NIL came on line, the SEC's dominance ended.
That all said, the reason the NFL is the most compelling and dominant sport in America is because the Cowboys cannot just buy Jordon Love and force the Packers to start over at QB because they cannot afford to play the game. An even playing field rewards great ownership, GMs, coaching, and yes, even great fan support. The problem cannot be solved without Congress....
I'm with you here...mostly.
Other than, we've had the same 12 teams for quite some time.
And yes, hard to argue that the last two champions were blue bloods. Been a long time you could call Michigan a blue blood in anything other than name only.
But, let's also remember that this will only be the second season of college football where there are players on the field who did not begin their college career under NIL. The collectives are going away as schools/programs are clawing back a little more control. Everything is going to change again over the next 5 years.
It's possible some of the blue bloods will misstep and maybe Indiana will take their place. Or someone very much like Indiana.
But at the end of the day, I just don't see how we don't wind up with the same 7-8 regulars 3-5 occasionals and the next 10 possibles in the mix year in, year out.
Westernhawk
Well-Known Member
Perhaps I should refine my comments a bit. It's the traditional blue bloods plus a few new players that have unlimited cash. I don't see that changing a lot.
Westernhawk
Well-Known Member
Yes. When teams can spend 10x the amount of others, there is a definite problem with balance. To the earlier posts about blue bloods, perhaps we need to define the new players as blue bloods by proxy. Texas Tech and Indiana have tons of money. Miami was a blue blood and they also have money.
I see the Dodgers just got the best pitcher in MLB, and they already had a great pitching staff!
Westernhawk
Well-Known Member
Let's take 2015 as an example (pre NIL).
Michigan State was #4. Iowa was #5. Standford #6. North Carolina #10. TCU #11. Northwestern #15. Oklahoma State was #16. Ect. Hardly all blue bloods that year.
2026 Preseason poll is expected to be something like: OSU, Texas, GA, Indiana (new money), ND, Oregon, Miami (Miami is a blue blood, one could argue).
Without doing a ton of research, it looks like the older blue bloods (plus new money) are set to be on top for a while.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
I love the example, but 2015 was an aberration. MSU barely beat Iowa to get into the playoffs and then got obliterated in the first round. Bama beat Clemson for the title. During the 4-team BCS era of the playoffs, I swear we had the same 5 or so damn teams in it every year (Bama, Georgia, Clemson, ND, OK, OSU). Since moving to 12 teams, there has been a little more diversity in teams making the playoffs, but it still feels like the same group of assholes getting into the final four (except Indiana is the new kid).
Westernhawk
Well-Known Member
That's fair, but I honestly just took a year out of the blue. I still believe we see teams with money (mostly typical blue bloods) tighten their stranglehold. We'll probably now see ND and USC as fixtures, sadly.
There were other outlier teams in the top 15 in addition to the four teams in the four team playoff era. I do agree that we saw the exact same teams in the 4 team era.
Westernhawk
Well-Known Member
Here's another random year, 2018, with some interesting top 25 teams that seem unlikely today:
Wash St, Syracuse, Fresno State, Army, West Virginia, Northwestern, Utah State, and our Hawks.
Not a lot of those teams have the money to compete now. I could be wrong and would very happily be corrected!
Wash St, Syracuse, Fresno State, Army, West Virginia, Northwestern, Utah State, and our Hawks.
Not a lot of those teams have the money to compete now. I could be wrong and would very happily be corrected!
BigD
Well-Known Member
"Hard to invest in that sort of system."
This is an understatement." When it come to fan's wearing their sport garb what does it mean? NOTHING. Any player worth their salt for over at least 80 percent of the time that means nothing. The next uniform they wear will be the highest bidder. So how do fans really get behind a team when the next thing you know they will be wearing another uniform and trying to beat your ass. Stirtz was an anomaly. We may not see anything like him again. Loyalty to a coach. Oh sure I am sure he got paid a bucket load of money for staying at Iowa, but he could have gone else where and got paid a swimming pool load of money.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
I think that is why we are pretty fortunate to be Iowa fans, especially with KF in football, but we are seeing a similar culture with Ben and MBB. KF talked about this at media day. His preference to invest in his existing roster and pay the kids that had been there putting the work in, rather than go out on the market and buy a new roster every year. Loyalty and relationships mean something to KF and I think he still really cares about developing his players into young men, whether that means success in the NFL or just in life. I don't get the sense that Ryan Day gives a shit about any of that stuff. These kids are just a means to end for most programs.
I have said it before and I will say it again. If the college system turns into a true minor league professional league I am out. The 5 for 5 change was a good start because it ensures that the players remain kids and not 30 year old part-time plumbers. They need to remain students working towards degrees. If Congress can cement in a salary cap and transfer restrictions, college sports will be in good shape for the near term.
BigD
Well-Known Member
There is noting you have just stated that I don't agree with.
"I've said it before and I will say it again. If the college system turns into a true minor league professional league I am out."
This part of your comments is a hard thing to deal with. I know Fry has commented about this a few times already and told forum posters on here that we all just need to accept things as they are and move on because it is what it is and if we don't like it we should go find something else to do. Seriously??? Tell people who have followed Iowa football for nearly 60 years to move on? People who have attended games or sat in front of a black and white 18 inch screen TV with the grandfather just to move on
Now having said that I totally get where Fry is coming from. He is just stating facts in that how we feel about it isn't going to change anything. The only way things could change is if fan's over all just get tired of it and do move on. It would have to be in dramatic masses and stadiums on Saturday's would have to have a lot of empty seats. Families have been following their favorite team for generations and so it's as much a family tradition as Thanksgiving's and Christmas family gatherings.
My thirty year old son was just asking me yesterday about how I thought the team was going to do this upcoming season. A huge question will be at the QB position and with little to no college experience under their belts its a guessing game at this point. Since we live here in Utah of course we know about the QB coming in from Utah. My son went over his stats and I was like huh????
I should have known considering how much BYU and Boise State care about that position and scoring LOT"S of points. LESTer we forget he turned both those schools down to come play for our new offensive coordinator............... and don't kid yourself that is why he chose Iowa.
Obviously someone is fronting some cash for this kid.
Sorry to wander off the beaten path there but I did circle the wagons and came back on track with talking about this QB from a Utah high school. Let's hope Lester can do his thing with the kid. I wouldn't be afraid to throw this QB into the fray even as a freshman. Now that would be a major change indicating things truly are moving differently at Iowa. Whomever comes out on opening day I truly wish them the best as generations in my home are carrying on Iowa Hawkeye tradition. Even my daughter in law wears Hawkeye tea shirts and Iowa Hawkeye sweaters even though they both attended and graduated from BYU....................... well nobody is perfect.
The Utah QB came to Iowa because of the Shannahan offense and the springboard to the NFL he hopes it will provide him. Reports out of camp are that he is super talented, the most talented of all the QBs. However, he is WAY behind in learning the system which we all know how difficult this offense is, even for a fifth year guy like Gronowski. I would be very surprised if he sees the field this year outside of a possible 2-3 snap game of handing it off to the RBs late in a blowout.There is noting you have just stated that I don't agree with.
"I've said it before and I will say it again. If the college system turns into a true minor league professional league I am out."
This part of your comments is a hard thing to deal with. I know Fry has commented about this a few times already and told forum posters on here that we all just need to accept things as they are and move on because it is what it is and if we don't like it we should go find something else to do. Seriously??? Tell people who have followed Iowa football for nearly 60 years to move on? People who have attended games or sat in front of a black and white 18 inch screen TV with the grandfather just to move on
Now having said that I totally get where Fry is coming from. He is just stating facts in that how we feel about it isn't going to change anything. The only way things could change is if fan's over all just get tired of it and do move on. It would have to be in dramatic masses and stadiums on Saturday's would have to have a lot of empty seats. Families have been following their favorite team for generations and so it's as much a family tradition as Thanksgiving's and Christmas family gatherings.
My thirty year old son was just asking me yesterday about how I thought the team was going to do this upcoming season. A huge question will be at the QB position and with little to no college experience under their belts its a guessing game at this point. Since we live here in Utah of course we know about the QB coming in from Utah. My son went over his stats and I was like huh????
I should have known considering how much BYU and Boise State care about that position and scoring LOT"S of points. LESTer we forget he turned both those schools down to come play for our new offensive coordinator............... and don't kid yourself that is why he chose Iowa.
Obviously someone is fronting some cash for this kid.
Sorry to wander off the beaten path there but I did circle the wagons and came back on track with talking about this QB from a Utah high school. Let's hope Lester can do his thing with the kid. I wouldn't be afraid to throw this QB into the fray even as a freshman. Now that would be a major change indicating things truly are moving differently at Iowa. Whomever comes out on opening day I truly wish them the best as generations in my home are carrying on Iowa Hawkeye tradition. Even my daughter in law wears Hawkeye tea shirts and Iowa Hawkeye sweaters even though they both attended and graduated from BYU....................... well nobody is perfect.
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BigD
Well-Known Member
Can’t argue with this also, but if he doesn’t get any experience until he is late into his junior how does that develop a QB? The other two guys haven’t showed much anyways. The one thing that one of them has is elusiveness and I like that and hope that if we are stuck with choosing between the two older QB’s (if you consider them older) I think duel threat QB’s are always more entertaining to watch. In this case is the quicker QB really a duel threat? We know he can run but thus far he hasn’t proven he can throw with any accuracy. If he gets his accuracy down then we will have something to talk about.
If not then the freshmen should get his shot. It’s not like other schools don’t start freshmen. Sure he will have ups and downs and growing pains, but that’s how you learn , grow, and develop.
